How would I know, I don't work for the club why don't you ask them? The club can ban people or remove their season ticket or right to attend matches, the rules are all in the booklet if you look. I don't find racist or homophobic abuse witty, there's nothing funny about picking on someone because of their nationality/ethnic group or sexuality, singling them out for vile personal attacks. Only bullies would resort to that form of personal attack and neither is it culturally acceptable and your argument about class is a total misnomer; children of all classes and backgrounds mix in school as they do when groups of school children attend the Valley. I won't be patronised about growing up either, there's nothing to enjoy if you're the butt of some odious verbal baggage. The examples given above are a relic from the past in the same way as are hooligans who still live in the past and the future is much better without them.
Well I don't and I get rather sick and tired of cheap attacks on those who try to make society more diverse and inclusive and likewise football more diverse and inclusive just as the FA does, only for this progress to be undermined from the tabloid press which invented the term 'pc' when their abuse of freedom came under scrutiny, still it backfired with the NoTW. If you don't have any rules and regulations then you get anarchy and it's perfectly possible to strike a balance between rights, responsibilities and boundaries.
It's all designed to intimidate the players and stir up aggression. Many children are put off playing and aren't allowed to enjoy the game because of similar abuse on pitches up and down the country in junior leagues by their parents, usually fathers.
Patrick. Honestly. Are you kidding? Emotion, passion are these beyond your comprehension? Have you ever had any of these? Your world sounds very boring and sterile. Put a whiskey in your bovril next game or at least chill out.
Stir up aggression? Really. Are you for real? The fa are a laughing stock in the football world and adopt the same crazy pig ignorant phillsophies that you do. no wonder sepp blatter keeps his job. And your comment about the notw just shows how desperate your argument is.
I've yet to hear any racist remarks in my Charlton games I've gone to. If they exist, they do need to stop. However, insulting a player of the opposing team is completely normal. It comes with their job. It might not be pleasant for them, but when they get paid that much they don't have much right to complain about a few bad words.
Striking a balance between rights, responsibilities and boundaries? Where is my right to stand in a football ground Where is my right to have a smoking section in a football ground Where is my right to have an alcohol drink at my seat Where is my right as a mature adult to have the top left on my bottle of drink Where is my right if the ref costs us 3 points through a poor decision, to put him under some pressure I am a season ticket holder, so I am sure if I fell into your category of person it would have been taken away from me by now. I accept all points on stamping out racism, however, the pc correct clearly do not know how to strike any sort of balance that you mention, exactly as you seem to fail to demonstrate any balance in your argument. What I want to know more importantly is what you are going to do about people who keep dropping their hotdogs, especially with ketchup on?
I mentioned elsewhere that I have not heard racist or homophobic chanting in the valley. Have I heard talk in the bars, yes, have I heard those songs in pubs (especially at away games) yes. There are racists etc in every walk of life and in every group of fans, most work places and on internet boards. I do not care who took what where, who we wont surrender to and what Lisbie gets up to. I certainly do not think that the singing of these songs affects the performance of the players either those mentioned or our own. These songs are supposed to upset people and I think make the singers look tough and funny. They look neither but me saying that will not stop it happening. Banning people might. Keeping that langauage out of the game is a must. However I do not find swearing in football grounds a problem. I explained to my daughter when I first took her to the Valley that is was OK to swear at football, but it was a time and a place. Kids swear at each other in the playground and if you think they do not, wake up people. I have often screamed at a ref and then apologised to someone who gives you a disapproving look. There should be passion and in football crowds that does equate to some (including me) as the first thing to come out of your mouth.
brb, I'd say I'm part of the mythical PC brigade, and I'm in complete agreement with your list up to the last one. I'm not the type to get too angry at the ref, but I don't mind other people getting angry at him, so I guess I'm fine with your whole list. I'm also OK with cursing at football, and ketchup on hotdogs. I've never heard those songs at the Valley, but I have heard them at nearly every away match I've been to this season. At Walsall they were shouted down. Does anyone know why the Ched Evans song/"banter" seems to appear at every away match?
IA - Anyway the topic that seems to have missed Charltonpat's attention, is what about all those hotdogs, burgers & pies sold in football grounds, when is he going to proceed on insisting on the banning of them. Not ok for me to kill someone with passive smoking but ok to kill millions of animals so we can proceed in giving ourselves heart disease. Plus dripping that animal fat everywhere out of our burgers must cause a health and safety issue?
You can get behind the team with emotion and passion without resorting to personal abuse and obscenities of players or anyone else, try it you might enjoy it.
Possibly the best post I've read on this thread. In all honesty, how many players upon being booed for the first time go 'Huh??? Whats going on? Nobody told me that my £10k a week job involved people swearing at me and calling me names!!? I knew I should have become a plasterer or a bricklayer.' Instead, they probably drive home in their Mercedes, park in the front garage of their mansion, go indoors, shag their supermodel girlfriend then lay in bed drinking champagne and watching TV. As for the ongoing debate between Typical and CharltonPat, there seems to be no 'balance' between the two polar opposite views. In my opinion, fans like CharltonPat and Typical should both be allowed to attend games, and not be labelled as 'not a true fan'. Personally I like to stand all game, singing (sometimes crude) songs, booing ex-Palace/Millwall players, calling the referee a ****er and leaping around like a madman when we score. But I hold nothing against fans who like to sit there with a blanket over there knee's, a chicken-mayo sandwich in their hands and who compare each player to those of our FA Cup winning team. Both are welcome and in fact, both are happy at The Valley. Us mentalists generally like to stand in the north upper, the quiet-sort generally sit in the East or West (or the South whenever Palace come to town). Its more difficult at away games as a lot of the time, the fans who like to sing and the fans who don't are mixed together. Saying that, I find it difficult to understand how many people would go to a game and be suprised to hear bad language, its part and parcel of football games and as far as I know, it ALWAYS has been. Not saying thats right, personally I feel its a persons right to go to a game without hearing such language if they so wish, but sometimes the world isn't quite as accomodating as we wish it would be.
Hang on.... Ive never said that the Reverend Pat should not attend games or the like.. I'm just concerned that he is branding our supporters as Jack Booted Nazis. He has failed to address all my expertly made points and continues with his tirade against free speech and expression. I'm just trying to regain some parity here!!! He has not even commented on the hot dogs being dropped (which i fail to believe are on the ground long enough at gillingham before they are picked up, brushed down and eaten and then regurgitated again that evening to feed the kids)
More importantly, can CharltonPat please confirm or deny, that you are infact our very own A2C?? I was always suspicious but the use of the word 'belittle' in one of your previous posts has made be certain it's you.
Some examples were given above of a player who was given personal abuse because of being black and that is what I was talking about. The incidents I took up with the club as did some other supporters were aimed at a black player from the PL years who was subjected to a tirade of abuse because of his race every game and it was dealt with and quite rightly so. That's what I call challenging racism not the other stuff you mention which is part and parcel of the game and it's the general swearing you hear but killer was talking about people who are singled out for personal abuse without any justification. You give examples of two extreme opposites whereas those around me appear to be in the middle.
Just a reminder of the rules for typical, note 9, 10 and 11 and the word threatening. How would I know if 7 applies to Gillingham. http://www.cafc.co.uk/page/groundregulations/0,,10267,00.html
