I’m noticing the anti-Jewish rhetoric is going up a notch again at the moment. There’s a guy on our board openly saying he just doesn’t like Jewish people.
That's the Zionist ethos though, which has unfortunately creeped more and more into Israeli politics. As you say, Israel is surrounded by Arab nations. It was literally supplanted into an Arab region but has never learned to live with its neighbours. It's like the Scots setting up an enclave in London and telling all the English people to **** off
Post this on here as well... Keir Starmer visiting Aushwitz with his wife who is Jewish, they have laid a wreath. https://www.gov.uk/government/news/pm-statement-following-visit-to-auschwitz-17-january-2025 Nothing could prepare me for the sheer horror of what I have seen in this place. It is utterly harrowing. The mounds of hair, the shoes, the suitcases, the names and details, everything that was so meticulously kept, except for human life As I stood by the train tracks at Birkenau, looking across that cold, vast expanse, I felt a sickness, an air of desolation, as I tried to comprehend the enormity of this barbarous, planned, industrialised murder: a million people killed here for one reason, simply because they were Jewish. My visit today has also shown me more clearly than ever before, how this was not the evil deeds of a few bad individuals. It took a collective endeavour by thousands of ordinary people who each played their part in constructing this whole industry of death. To build the tracks, drive the trains, extract the hair and teeth, conceive the method of mass murder – each stomach-churning step rooted in the hatred of difference. The lessons of this darkest of crimes are the ultimate warning to humanity of where prejudice can lead. My wife was equally moved by what she saw today. It was her second visit, but no less harrowing than the first time she stepped through that gate and witnessed the depravity of what happened here. Time and again we condemn this hatred, and we boldly say “never again”. But where is never again, when we see the poison of antisemitism rising around the world in aftermath of October 7th? Where is never again, when the pulse of fear is beating in our own Jewish community, as people are despicably targeted once again for the very same reason, because they are Jewish. The truth that I have seen here today will stay with me for the rest of my life. So too, will my determination to defend that truth, to fight the poison of antisemitism and hatred in all its forms, and to do everything I can to make “never again” mean what it says, and what it must truly mean: never again.
Fair play to him for that. Very similar to how my dear Mother described it when she visited. She told me the place still feels and smells like death. It got too much for her at one point and she broke down. Very unlike her.
It's one thread of the Zionist ethos. There are quite a few of them. Some historically didn't even involve the small strip of land between the river and the sea. I think sometimes we need to take a more optimistic view. Israel doesn't get on with quite a few of its neighbours, but it holds full diplomatic relations with Egypt, Jordan, Bahrain, UAE and Morocco. That's not amazing, but not bad given the context and the fact that it was only established 75 years ago. England and France were in a permanent state of on-off war from 1100 - 1800. England and Ireland were in a permanent state of on-off rebellion and conflict from 1650 - 1990. What's 75 years among neighbours?
I should have quantified that comment with 'one strand' of Zionism. And Ben Gvir represents the most extreme version of it I get what you're saying about other nations being at conflict with each other. But Israel has been in conflict with its neighbours since the get go, and ever since. Its entire history is one of conflict with its neighbours. I hope it can find a way to live peacefully and equitably with other nations, without feeling like it has to occupy them or build a wall around themselves.
A family member of one of the hostages has said this afternoon, this deal Israel are agreeing is the same deal they rejected May last year - the only change is Trump, his words.
It's not though. I've literally just listed 5 of its neighbours who not long ago wanted it destroyed and now hold full treaties with Israel. Two of those neighbours are on its borders. We have to hold on to hope that there will be further breakthroughs. The big one is Saudi Arabia. They need to do much, much more for the region instead of focusing on the boxing careers of annoying YouTubers.
And the Abraham accords were not without their problems also, especially for Palestine. Which you could argue pushed Hamas into even more extreme territory.
well yes since the armies of their neighbours immediately attacked them on Israels formation formation they do tend to be suspicious of them
You could, I won't. At some point we have to celebrate progress and embrace it when it happens. What hope is there for the region if every gesture of goodwill is met with scepticism? We also need to stop infantilising the various factions within the Palestinian people. The world is superb at this, treating them like society's toddlers who are never responsible for their own actions. Hamas has been extreme since the 1980s. It got more extreme as a reaction to the Oslo Accords. Were they a bad thing? It has never once tried to come to the negotiating table and find a way that doesn't involve violence. We have to stop making excuses for them.
The Abraham accords, specifically, normalised relations between Israel and other Arab nations, but crucially left out a Palestinian state as part of the process. That's not progress for Palestine A gesture of goodwill perhaps for Israel, but at the expense of the region it occupies and subjugates. Without the backing of other Arab nations, you can understand why Hamas sought closer ties with Iran, Hezbollah and extremism. It's like the cornered wild animal, when it feels like its existence is threatened and it has nothing to lose, it lashes out.
No, I don't understand, so you're saying when someone don't get what they want, you can understand why they turn to extremism (terrorism), makes you sound a bit of a **** that. Surely that's akin to saying far right extremism is ok, it's not.
No that's not what I'm saying at all. It's far more detailed and nuanced than that When the Arab nations that normalised relations with Israel, which previously included recognition of a Palestinian state, then dropped that part under the last Trump administration (which was more concerned with isolating Iran and rewarding Arab nations with sweeteners to sign the accords), the result was that Palestine was also isolated. As a result, instead of having the backing of moderate Arab countries like UAE etc, they turned more to Iran as they were the only country with influence that would support their cause. The US predicted this, and they predicted that it would result in an upturn of violence, so why did they persist with the Abraham accords knowing it would isolate Palestine and likely strengthen ties between Hamas and Iran ? This article explains this all in a bit more detail https://responsiblestatecraft.org/abraham-accords-peace-middle-east/
