I blame all sides and by that I don't just mean Hamas and Israeli's. Anyone that thinks it's ok to treat human beings in this way, really don't deserve to exist. Much as I think the same about Ukraine or Russia, Zelenskyy or Putin, what is the end goal, is it peace because if it is I'm just not seeing it. I was watching the German news last night and how the first far right party has led the exit polls since the Nazi's 70+ years on, it felt strange as well hearing the story being defined as East Germany. I've come to the conclusion we are all just a bunch of kunts.
That really depends on 'what happens next' - and also the extent of religious belief ... What is beyond dispute is that the wider World's attention is now significantly more focused on the region than it has ever been in the entire history of 'modern Israel' - and with a growing appetite (outside of Israel and possibly the US) for finding a permanent, 2 state solution ... If you are one of those Hamas leaders, you will claim these aspecrs as 'victory' ... one achieved by the 'sacrifice of martyrs' (the religious factor) - these are religious zealots, prepared to die for their cause ... the reality, particularly for those of us in secular countries, is that the whole thing has been a tragedy for humanity, the catalyst for which was a barbaric terrorist act on 7th October... Netanyahu and the Israeli zealots don't want to stop the war against the Palestinians, particularly those operating under a Hamas banner until they have annihilation of Palestinian opposition - completely unachievable - future generations of Palestinian resistance (absent an International brokered solution) will have greater numbers than Hamas ever did - and the collateral slaughter of Arab women and children can never be justified ... neither can Netanyahu's obvious disregard for maximising hostage recovery ...
A bunch of fat old men living a life of luxury in Qatar ain't thinking their own lives are sacrificed for the greater good I bet they ****ing **** themselves and cried for help. Only the young are sacrificed
You obviously know them better than I do ... perhaps they're not really Muslim at all? ... and obviously completely unaware of Mossad's capabilities over decades .... ... but, as you say, only the young are sacrificed - particularly if you are a Palestinian kid ...
I didn't know some more people had been got at in Qatar? I knew about one bigwig being blitzed a week of two back, but hadn't realised there had been more since. So do you think the hostages were killed in retaliation?
No, I mean they are based in Qatar where they are untouchable One of the heads who is usually based in Qatar travelled to Iran for talks and his hotel was bombed. Tbf to you brb, this is complicated ****.
The hostages were (predictably) killed as the IDF were approaching the location (tunnels) where they were being held in Gaza (near Khan Younis) This has directly caused all the civil unrest and demonstrations in Israel right now.... Netanyahu is, of course, blaming Hamas for the deaths - but the relatives of those hostages (and now a huge swathe of the Israeli public including the most powerful trades union in Israel) are putting the deaths squarely at Netanyahu's door, accusing him of pursuing his own goals and political survival at the expense of (their loved ones) hostage lives ...
Seems quite logical to blame the people who kidnapped, kept them hostage for 10 months and killed them.
Probably not when you are a relative of someone being held and knowing that a ceasefire and exchange of prisoners can (as already proven) bring your loved ones back alive ... ... but it's not me you need to convince - go tell the tens of thousands now demonstrating against Netanyahu and his tactics in major Israeli cities ...
I did say at the beginning of all this and particularly to CK they were never interested in the hostages (meaning Nety) - we've seen enough hostage negotiations in our lifetime, to know these hostages were not folllowing a set path of discussions that you would normally see in these situations from around the world. That's not me casting judgement on Nety or Israel, I will leave others to decide that, but if they were my kids, I would know it's highly likely I was never going to see them again, especially if male. It was always a mission of revenge, or of war as the Western media call it. Biden has come out today in recent hours and said Nety is not doing enough in negotiations...he's right...but even Biden's words ring hollow to me, because he knows what's been going on and has not done anything to stop it. I don't pretend to know any answers, but I do think the world has gone mad. All life should be sacred but we act like we are a disease, all for something called religion, well all I can say to all sides, your religious beliefs are a far distance from mine if this is how you all behave.
They’d probably be easier to convince than you. It’s probably time for Israel to make the clips of October 7th public and shut Hamas fans up at least for a while.
Maybe they can do that tonight (19:00 BST 17:00) when The Hostages and Missing Families Forum lead several public demonstrations including one outside Netanyahu's residence ... sure they'll agree with your take ... indeed, you could have flown out to remonstrate ... oh wait ... no you couldn't ... the airport workers are on strike in protest and solidarity with those opposed to Netanyahu's tactics...
Maybe you could stop having such **** opinions on something you still know less than **** all about. Obviously the families want the hostages back at any cost. It’s not realistic or long term in the country’s interests. Pandering to Hamas doesn’t work. It never has nor will.
... but trying to obliterate Palestinian resistance does? ... obviously not ... .. and I've been around long enough to witness how the Middle-East situation has evolved for likely twice as long as you've been alive - and would back my more impartial knowledge and judgement against your obviously indoctrinated partisan bias ... every time ... ... and as for realistic and long term? ... that's simple - the only viable solution is 2 states respecting each others boundaries and right to exist ... nothing else will work ... obviously.
Yes I remember you calling this right back at the beginning of the crisis and I have to admit, I underestimated Netanyahu's resolve/stubbornness on this. But at the same time, that isn't to say that negotiations were/are impossible (and no, we haven't lived through a handful if any hostage situations like this in our lifetime, which is one of the reasons it's so darn complicated). Israel's terms have been very clear from the start: We will stop flattening Gaza if you hand back the hostages and Hamas disarms and disbands permanently. The latter can either be accomplished diplomatically, or militarily. Hamas has no interest in disarming, so negotiations have so far ground to a halt. I think Netanyahu has been emboldened by the relative political fatigue of the major world powers (that's what it is: fatigue, no-one can really be arsed to even attempt to solve a problem as complicated as this. Gone are the statesmen of the past like Sadat, Rabin, Peres and Kissinger with the energy and determination to at least try and try again.) and he has recently expanded Israel's demands to include a military presence in the Philadelphi Corridor even after the conflict has ended. He has probably played that card knowing that Hamas is now even less likely to come to any terms, but he no longer cares. Hamas are on the brink of total defeat anyway. And here's the rub: On Oct 7th, Hamas gambled the lives of every man, woman and child in Gaza on the hope that the hostages could be used to barter a 'victory' of sorts which could be used to justify the blindly reckless decision taken on that fateful day. They now stand to receive almost nothing to take back to their people. On Oct 10th, Netanyahu gambled the lives of every hostage by making the final and complete destruction of Hamas the #1 goal of the operation. If he backs down now and Hamas survives to fight another day, he too will have very little to take back to his people.
You’ve just had longer to continue being ignorant. Every time Palestinians are given an inch they’ve taken a mile. Every time Israel cedes a bit or turns a blind eye to an attack too small for people like you to hear about they’re emboldened. All they respect is the threat of being crushed.
I've often looked at religious writings such as the bible, as a scripture of people control, but what happens when the scriptures get torn up and replaced by hatred. Well we see the answer to that in front of our very eyes, because no one is keeping to their religious beliefs, it's become a no-holds-barred contest by mad men - but hey then it's all just tales isn't it, just like the lies we were told as a child about father christmas and the fairies, surely true religion would not believe in such savagery that is before us. We all stand or kneel to pray as another chunk of arm or leg goes flying past us, well on tv anyway, like a comedy sketch from Monty Python, only this is real and not funny in the slightest, as various men flex their muscles, so I have to ask is this really god that worketh within us causing such mayhem and destruction. Maybe we just need to stop making excuses and find answers before the devil consumes us...TLDR please log in to view this image
