There may be some fans that recount back to the old school and pull a "gentleman jack jones 1,000,000 appearances and a bazillion goals for city between 1867 and 1868 and all with a broken back" but for my money, Holt is the best goal scoring forward we've ever had. He was made to score goals. Our Christmas present this year should be Holt and Morrison, terrifying defences. Great win yesterday, lots to think about team wise for the next game though...
I was going to say I'm glad it's not me picking the team next week, but wtf do I do about RBF's line-up CPL????
They're all poor men's Darren Beckford's in my eyes Flecky used to be my favourite as a youngster, and Kevin Drinkell before he (until he refused to have his photo with me when I was a mascot in the 80's ) . Loved Dean Ashton (even before we signed him, always a legend on Championship Manager) and was as devastated when his career ended as I was delighted when we signed him. Great to see him in our shirt for a year or so, he would have been phenomenal if he'd had any decent level of fitness. Hucks' book is quite interesting, apparently when he first turned up he had to take monday and tuesday off training to recover from saturday's game - he was only 22!! Loved Chrissy Sutton as well, and of course the man Hucks himself, but I kinda agree with Beefy that right now Grant Holt has to be right up there as the one of the very best we've had in my lifetime at least. What he has done and where he has driven us from where we were when he came long just over two years ago is nothing short of unbelievable. Third tier football where most people thought he probably belonged all the way to top ten in the Premier League - with awesome goals at Chelsea and Liverpool as well as one of the best under-pressure penalties I've ever seen against Blackburn and then yesterday's wnner - this is seriously Roy of the Rovers stuff and surely beyond his wildest dreams three season ago when he was lining up for Shrewsbury on a windy November tuesday night game at Morecambe. I love the man and won't have a bad word said against him. All this nonsense about him being a 'sinner' because he's joining in the party and taking a few theatrical tumbles here and there - do me a favour! He absolutely loves this club, would crawl over broken glass for it and most importantly US the fans and we should all count ourselves very, VERY lucky to have him as our talisman. We owe him an awful lot for what he's done, and as I touched upon in the match day thread he is quite possibly the only man dead or alive who I would even consider noshing off to completion.
Can't believe this lads. Long term memories gone have they. I like to love in the moment but I don't get carried away. I too like Holt. He uses his best resources to bags lots of goals. Most of which have been in the bottom 3 divisions. When he has scored consistently in the top divsion like Sutton did, then you can quote "best ever". That's not a condemnation of Holt just a reflection on how good Sutton was. Ask Henrik Larsen who was the best player he played alongside.
Oh I don't necessarily mean in terms of technical ability or anything like that - though I do think his is massively underrated and that's he's far more than a hustle and bustle work-horse, he's scored all sorts of goals from all sorts of position and reads the game beautifully - but in terms of his impact, goal scoring record and the journey the club has been on with him being the driving force (alongside Lambert of course, I'm not being silly) in such a short space of time he takes some beating.
There is something pretty unusual going on when he can come on and seemingly score at will against otherwise competent Premiership defences.In the case of Liverpool and QPR it was pretty much instant,within three minutes.Yesterday he had almost put the header away before Wes got the cross in for the one he did get. I think it might be that he is just one of those rare players who instinctively knows where the ball is going and gets in there.Ted MacDougall had the knack, although compared to Holt he was a lazy b****r who spent half the game standing with his hands on his hips.IMHO it isn't out of order to put Holt amongst the best of them.Just look at the stats.Bent,Agbonlahor,Van deVaart, have only scored one or two goals more and they have spent a lot more time on the pitch.Don't forget that for the last half dozen games he has had barely a half hour in which to score.His rate/time played must be pretty damn good.
Holty's got 57 goals for us now, and he's still only 30, so he's looking good for 100 in my eyes, especially if we go down this year. I've been counting his Norwich goal tally ever since he joined as I had a feeling he might make a century, so hopefully he'll do it. Oh, and I've got a fiver on him to score ten goals this season, so if he gets to just 63, I'm fine with that too.
Difficult question they all offer different things as players, you have to take into consideration the players around them, how the manager and coaching staff played them on the pitch and developed them as players or the league they were in. If you take Ashton for an example if he wasn't blighted with injuries and played under Lambert in League One and the Championship he could of scored about a 100 goals but we'll never know. Holt as player has self belief and determination, he has fairly decent technical ability nothing too special though, he's a good finisher, he can create things too, I think what lets him down is when he throws himself on the deck, if he had more pace, fitness and was about 26 he would be absolutely lethal, not taking anything away from him as his doing superb considering the time his getting on the pitch.
It's his down to earth character that I really like.You can imagine that he really appreciates being our talisman rather than going to work tomorrow morning and fitting a pair of Goodyears to Mrs.Robinsons's Focus for eight quid an hour.I think that kind of background gives something that you don't get with stars. Why I would prefer say, Allan Johnson to Jacob Rees-Mogg. (He's a Tory "Young Fogey" btw) Despite the fact that the latter probably knows his vintage clarets like he does his Gold Amex card and the former only comes near one when he puts it through his letterbox.
We had some magnificent strikers in the past, Ron Davies being phenomenal, but all were scored in lower divisions before 1972. Ted MacDougall, Phil Boyer, Kevin Reeves, Kevin Drinkell all scored plenty in the top league. I don't think ability necessarily comes into it. Scoring is all that matters. Steve Bull would have admiited to being at the back of the queue skill wise but 250+ goals in 500 games is proof of his exceptional ability in one area. Holt is a crowd pleaser to us and a fat lad to opponents and canny enough to exploit that. I hope he does go on to become a legend but in 20 years time when you lads will be saying how you remember him, young shavers will be on here raving about a new striker and poo pooing him. I guess its called History.
Holty has dragged his team by the scruff of the neck up two divisions, now Lambo starts with Morison up front, does he sulk and complain? Does he hell, he waits for his opportunity and scores consistently.......Legend
As much as I love Holt, I'm afraid he would not get into my all time 11 (of players I have seen. I'd probably go with Sutton and Bellamy. There are others who would also be in contention such as Ashton, Fleck, Robins, Drinkell, Iwan and Holt to name a few (I am sure there are others.), but these guys are behind Nellars and sutton imo.
I think it depends on how you rate skill and pace against pure goalscoring.The strikers you mention are the purist's choices.Steve Bull was mentioned and he's a good comparison,Bob Latchford,Malcolm MacDonald,Big Fat Joe,Duncan Disorderly are others.Personally I think Holt stands comparison with the best of the smash and grab goalscorers.Lacking in pace and skill,quite possibly.His positional sense though is second to none. His goals against Liverpool and QPR within three minutes of coming on could possibly just be chance but if it happens again any time soon then I think there is something else coming into his play.If you watch them in each case he gets between two defenders to score very much against the odds.I really don't think he can be left out of the starting line up after yesterday.
Maybe it is not being in the starting line up that is giving him these chances? Maybe a fresh Holt coming into play in the final third of a game against defenders who are tiring a little and have got into a bit of a comfort zone in dealing with the threat from Norwich before his introduction is ideal for him? we all know how Holt does not give defenders a second to compose themselves by chasing every cause lost or not. It must be a nightmare for a defender to adapt to this 60 or so mins into a game when they are tiring both physically and mentally.
I like Holt but he wouldn't get in my top 11 of strikers that I have seen at Carrow Road. In addition to the ones you mention there are Terry Bly, Ron Davies, David Cross, Ted MacDougall, John Gavin, Hugh Curran, Justin Fashanu, Terry Allcock etc etc. Grant has scored some crucial goals for us this year but how much of that is due to Morison roughing up the defence first.
i've only watched city for less than 25 years so its difficult to say who would be best ever. most talented striker i've watched was ashton - would have had numerous england caps had injury not blighted him, fleck was a personal hero of mine, sutton was so powerful but holt for me is a legend simply because he is a normal bloke. he plays the game like a fan and for me he represents every single one of us fanatical people who go every week to support the club but weren't good enough to play. holt is all of us on the pitch and thats why we all love him so much. its a rare thing these days to see a player like that
Agree with all you say Superman but the thread was ' best ever striker ' which is a bit different especially when he is not even guaranteed first choice now that we are in the Premiership. All the other strikers mentioned were first name on the teamsheet week in week out. I would certainly put him in the race for ' most loved player ever ' or 'Clubman of his generation'
