Interesting from Autosport . Max to Merc ? ( amongst other things ) Could Red Bull civil war really trigger shock Verstappen F1 switch to Mercedes? Despite it being the only story in town in Formula 1 right now, very few people know what's really going on behind the scenes with Christian Horner at Red Bull. please log in to view this image Jonathan NobleMar 3, 2024 at 2:14 PM Upd: Mar 3, 2024 at 4:33 PM 19 please log in to view this image Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing Christian Horner, Team Principal, Red Bull Racing Mark Sutton / Motorsport Images One thing is sure though: this saga is far from over, and the ultimate end game may not become clear for quite some time yet. Ever since the controversy first blew up last month, there had been speculation that this stretched far beyond being an internal matter involving Horner and a female employee. From the off, there was talk of this being a wider power play that involved some of the key management pillars within the Red Bull organisation. After all, the entire thing had gone public only after the Austrian Red Bull energy drinks company had uncharacteristically put an official statement out. For a brand widely known to have a policy of saying not one word more than it needs to when it comes to press statements, blowing the thing out into the open offered food for thought about there being more to this than meets the eye. As the saga developed, word spread that this had morphed into something far wider and was now a battle for control and influence between the Austrian side of the Red Bull company and its Thai majority owner Chalerm Yoovidhya. Somewhere in the middle of all of this was Red Bull motorsport advisor Helmut Marko and the Verstappen camp of Max and Jos, who each had their own opinions about what they felt should happen. please log in to view this image Businessman Chalerm Yoovidhya, Christian Horner, Team Principal, Red Bull Racing, Geri Horner celebrate in Parc Ferme Photo by: Steven Tee / Motorsport Images Plus, we had to throw into the mix the influence of Red Bull's major corporate partners like Ford and Oracle, although it is hard to work out which side of the fence they were sitting on. On one hand, some have claimed there was boardroom angst over the companies potentially getting tarnished by the ties to the mess at Red Bull. However, others have suggested that their biggest concern was actually potentially losing Horner, whose influence and appeal to the wider world were key factors in driving them to get involved in the first place. A takedown campaign For a few short hours after Wednesday's announcement by Red Bull that Horner had been cleared by an independent investigation, it seemed that things would settle down as attention would quickly shift back to the fortunes of the team's RB20 on track. But this idea was blown out of the water halfway through second practice on Thursday evening when two anonymous emails were sent to senior F1 personnel – including FIA president Mohammed Ben Sulayem, F1 CEO Stefano Domenicali, team principals and media. In the emails was a tranche of WhatsApp messages and images that were alleged to be central to the investigation. Although the veracity of the dossier has not been confirmed - and there have been rumours that a second document release is on its way - the real significance is that it shows there are now individuals deliberately manoeuvring to take Horner down. The real question though is, who and why? Those involved have to have close ties to the Red Bull organisation and team – either professionally or personally – to have had access to evidence that it is understood was handed to investigators for analysis. A lot of paddock gossip has surrounded Jos Verstappen, who is known not to have always seen eye-to-eye with Horner over various things that have happened since Max joined the Red Bull organisation. His dramatic comments on Saturday night, made to The Daily Mail, certainly leave us in no doubt that he falls into the camp that wants Horner out. "There's tension here while he remains in position," said the Dutchman. "The team is in danger of being torn apart. It can't go on the way it is. It will explode. He is playing the victim, when he is the one causing the problems." But there is a world of difference between wanting something to happen and being a perpetrator to make it happen. And Verstappen has been at pains to rubbish the idea that he has been behind a smear campaign or the email drops. "That wouldn't make sense," he added. "Why would I do that when Max is doing so well here?" Opportunity calls Whether he is a passenger or driver in all that is happening cannot be confirmed right now. However, the events are putting Verstappen Sr in a position to capitalise on there potentially being a change at the top of Red Bull. And, amid the crisis within the world champion squad, it has also opened up – in the Piranha Club that is F1 – opportunities for others to gain too. Perhaps one of the more interesting theories being bandied about is that what is going on at Red Bull involves a real big-picture play surrounding senior staff contracts and Red Bull's own long-term future in F1. It is widely accepted that Horner's presence in Red Bull has been a critical element in giving many senior staff at the team a sense of security. Indeed, it is understood that a number of top personnel – including chief technology officer Adrian Newey – have clauses in their contracts that allow them to leave if Horner is gone. please log in to view this image George Russell, Mercedes-AMG F1 Team, pole man Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing, in Parc Ferme Photo by: Mark Sutton / Motorsport Images It would not be a surprise that such a clause exists in Verstappen's deal too, which locks him down to the team until 2028. So, if somehow there was a desire for individuals to get out of the current deal - either to renegotiate terms or go elsewhere - then a Horner exit could open the door on it. From Verstappen's perspective, being a free agent could allow him to agree on a fresh contract on more favourable terms – be it for more money (as he is a much bigger superstar than when he first signed up), better marketing rights, or more flexibility. Or there could even be the prospect of a move elsewhere to forge a new path in his career. After all, Jos Verstappen's comments make it now almost untenable that his son and Horner can both continue without something changing. In the background, there could certainly be grounds to think the grass may be greener elsewhere long term. What if, as F1 heads to new engine rules in 2026, rumours are true that point to a change in the competitive order – and potentially Red Bull's power unit not delivering the kind of performance figures that other manufacturers are set to reach? That could leave Verstappen helpless to avoid knowing that the current run of success he is enjoying could come to an abrupt end from 2026 - unless of course Horner is gone and he can jump ship. Should Verstappen become a free agent, then there would be no shortage of rival teams interested in taking him – and the rumour mill has already pointed in one clear direction: Mercedes. The German manufacturer had been interested in Verstappen when he was in the junior categories, but it lost out to Red Bull because it could not offer him a seat in F1 machinery at the time. Seeing the Dutchman slip from Mercedes' grasp has long played on Mercedes boss Toto Wolff's mind, and is influencing his desire to not let junior Andrea Kimi Antonelli go. please log in to view this image Jos Verstappen with Toto Wolff, Team Principal and CEO, Mercedes-AMG F1 Team Photo by: Jon Noble As Wolff said recently about Red Bull grabbing Verstappen: "We lost the young driver, and you can see how successful he has become." With Mercedes having a cockpit available for 2025, and it perhaps being too early for Antonelli, Mercedes would clearly jump at the chance of Verstappen. He would be a superstar replacement for Lewis Hamilton; with the speed and global popularity that would act as a tremendous boost to the Mercedes brand. Furthermore, if Mercedes could snatch one of Red Bull's biggest assets, it would help make itself stronger and its rival weaker: a double whammy. It probably was not a coincidence that in the paddock, shortly after Red Bull had unleashed its dominant performance in the Bahrain Grand Prix, Jos Verstappen was spotted deep in conversation with Wolff. It is understood not to have been the first chat they had over the Bahrain GP weekend. There were rumours of a dinner meeting on Friday night too, even if Wolff insists he is not hatching a plot to lure Verstappen on board. Wanting a fast car For now, the Horner situation is an unknown variable and whether or not he remains in place is hard to predict, especially if the campaign to discredit him gets more aggressive in the forthcoming days. And no matter how defiant Horner is about staying in place, his fate will almost certainly be decided in the boardrooms of Red Bull and its corporate sponsors who will be paying a watching brief over all that is happening. please log in to view this image Christian Horner, Team Principal, Red Bull Racing, and Max Verstappen, Red Bull Racing, 1st position, celebrate in Parc Ferme Photo by: Zak Mauger / Motorsport Images Wolff too is observing from the sidelines, and will not be blind to the possibility that circumstances could play out that hand him an unexpected gift. But equally, he knows he has to get his own house in order because while Verstappen may be attractive to Mercedes, the desire to move there will not be so great if the squad's F1 car does not show better performance. Wolff himself was asked on Saturday night in Bahrain if there was a chance that Verstappen could drive at Mercedes in 2025 – and he gave a carefully considered response. "I think the driver will always choose the quickest car," he said. "That is fundamentally what it's all about. At the moment the Red Bull is the quickest car, so that will obviously be the priority." Read into that answer what you will. But it was not a 'no'. Be part of Autosport community please log in to view this image
It wouldn’t surprise me if by Monaco , Horner & Newey will be at Aston Martin . The corporate people won’t care as it’s Stroll senior
How Newey has stayed at RBR for so long is mind boggling to me. It's time to build a Scarlet rocket ship before retirement my man!
Do you know what I’ve always found utterly mad about Red Bull- having just about savaged Renaults reputation to the point of no return, they then had no choice other than to be lucked into getting a works deal with Honda, who McLaren took all the pain for as they progressed slowly with their hybrid engine, and then when they nailed it and led them to the championship, they binned them off too!! Why was that? Then turned down a partnership with Porsche too. I wonder if some of these differing opinions might have started at that point?
Yes I wonder about the Porsche thing . Is it right that Porsche wanted 50% of the team , and that’s why RBR ended it ?
Yes I believe there was a disagreement about their stake in the team. With that in mind- a lot of this does keep coming back to power and control- clearly Horner not wanting to give any more up- and others wanting to increase theirs/hand over some control.
That's what was reported, they wanted enough of the team to actually have a say on the directions the team takes.
You do wonder about Red Bull for 2026. New Aero rules mean there's no legacy advantage, building an engine for the first time is an incredibly difficult thing to do and their leadership is locked in a civil war. Max jumping ship might not be as crazy an idea as it first sounds
Also according to the article , several senior team members have clauses in their contracts that mean if Horner goes , they can as well . which is why I said I could see Horner and Newey at Aston Martin .
I'm still clinging on the Newey to Ferrari. Stop this silly talk. I can see your point tho, Stroll wouldn't care about any of the Horner controversy if he could secure those two as a package. The part of that prospect that fills me with dread is Lance Stroll WDC.
If the leaked messages were not originated by Horner, in my opinion he would have said so. Geri is putting on a brave face or Horner has an agreement with her too. The off curcuit is more interesting than the on circuit. But I am not entertained by any of it but am curious as to the outcome. I think, roll on 2026 provided I haven't aged or died.
Yes Newey would be good for Ferrari and if he wanted to remain in the UK , that may not be an issue as they built a place here for John Barnard . I have said before I don’t think Lance is that bad a driver , but I honestly doubt he will ever be a WDC unless he does a Keke Rosberg
I could 100% see Max at Aston Martin in the future. Lawrence Stroll would jump at that. They’ve got the facilities and personnel (Fallows) and the works engine deal (Honda) all in place for the future (2026 and beyond). It would also be a brand new legacy and chapter of F1. The challenge of leading them to the front of the grid. I can see that appealing. He really should be a 5 time WDC by then if his team can not implode beforehand!!
Makes no sense to try to implode RBR and then move elsewhere with the people you're trying to take down. It feels like the Verstappen's want full control of RBE to me. I find myself in the awkward situation where I hope Horner squashes them.
From Mail Sport ;-- Verstappen’s father Jos confirmed there are tensions within the Red Bull camp, and made the argument that Horner should not be continuing in his role. “There is tension here while he remains in position,” the former F1 driver told Mail Sport. “The team is in danger of being torn apart. “It can’t go on the way it is. It will explode. He is playing the victim, when he is the one causing the problems.” The same report also suggested Horner and Verstappen had had an argument in the paddock after qualifying, before shaking hands.
Weird isn’t it ? I have made my feelings about Horner as a person , but if. ( seems to be the case ) he is being forced out , then I want him to stay
Its something to do with verstappen anyway. he's set it in motion for a reason that will only come clear when he wants it to. Marko revealed at the time of the brat's new contract that he had an exit clause built in so the 2028 contract isn't worth the paper its written on. Either he wants something in red bull or he wants out having seen something for 2026. As we stand 2024 and 2025 should be locked in verstappen titles if newey is there to do the 2025 car. what could he want bar total control of the team? In case people have not noticed adrian newey is 65. while he might love it the travel has to start getting less and his time being the man is nearing its end or he will just work himself to death. does Verstappen see a move elsewhere? has jos been tapped up? only time will tell.
