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Off Topic Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by ChilcoSaint, Feb 23, 2016.

  1. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Has he not already shown you this by his actions?

    I note that the other opponent to Putin in the forthcoming “elections” has also “made errors” on his form so will probably not be able to run against him. Second opponent that’s happened to. Strange.
     
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  2. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    Obviously. I think he’s awful. But I still want to hear what he has to say.

    When has censorship ever been on the right side of history? Even if it’s someone like Putin, it’s important for the world to hear it
     
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  3. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    John Sweeney, who has more journalistic integrity in his left little toenail than Tucker Carlson can even dream of, has just speculated that the only reason Carlson has been granted this interview is “so he can lick Putin’s bottom”.

    Sweeney is currently in Amsterdam, reporting on a meeting of exiled Russian journalists, all of whom have first hand knowledge that in Putin’s Russia, the only alternatives to criticism of Putin are exile or assassination.
     
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  4. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    You mean like Julian Assange? Or Edward Snowden?

    Listen, call me crazy, but if the politicians want to send all my money to fight this guy, and possibly even send me to war… I want to hear why. I want to hear what he says. That is the least we are owed.
     
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  5. Gregm1988

    Gregm1988 Well-Known Member

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    Neither of those are journalists. Had to quickly check on assange
     
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  6. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    I don’t see the link, must be my extreme leftiness.
     
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  7. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    I don’t entirely disagree.
     
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  8. Gregm1988

    Gregm1988 Well-Known Member

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    My cheeky response would how would we ever know if censorship has been on the right side of history or not if it worked as intended…

    But I know that’s not what you mean :p
     
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  9. ......loading......

    ......loading...... 25 undefeated

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    https://www.ft.com/content/128428e4-7517-11dd-ab30-0000779fd18c

    This article was written in 2008. It very clearly spells out Putin's grievance and very easily puts it in its place. The words "vacuous" and "dishonest" it uses to describe Putin's justifications for his actions are bang on the nail. What you, Os, are asking for, is a former KGB officer assigned to the Stasi. These are two of history's most horrendous abusers of civil liberties. They are so far from anything anyone on the right wing - with even the vaguest sense of the importance of individual freedoms - should support that it BLOWS. MY. MIND. the American right has swung to support him. Not so long ago, even mentioning Russia would have had McCarthy in a rage.

    Why has that changed? Think about this. With your open-minded clarity. Why has the view of the American right shifted around to support Putin? Is it because in Russia individual freedoms are oppressed? Or is it because Putin pumps huge money into his propaganda machine? Or is it because he has the most highly active internet hackers in the world destabilising intelligent debate wherever he finds it? Or is it simply because Putin's way is simple: old-fashioned morality with zero capacity for deviation?

    You want to hear what Putin says? He has been saying the same things for 20 years. It has taken us way too long to listen and oppose him. We are supposed to learn from History. The last man who blatantly told us what he wanted and then started taking it took the Rhineland, Austria, the south of Czechoslovakia, Lithuania and... parts of Ukraine. All the time people shouted, wait! We need to hear what Hitler has to say!
     
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  10. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    “Putin = EVIL, western politicians = GOOD”

    Great chatting with you
     
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  11. ......loading......

    ......loading...... 25 undefeated

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    It would be if you read the article and my post and engaged with it. Putin is evil by so many definitions. The West is very easy to lump together, but I promise you that more people are flooding TOWARDS the west than TOWARDS Russia. Why? Because Western values are aligned with the rights of society to live well. Russia is a syphon, taking money from the masses and manoeuvring it towards the corrupt oligarchs.

    Capitalism does the same thing, by the way, but it is forced to shield that into more transactional logic. They syphoning is slower and has some benefit to the mainstream. I would happily engage with you that Capitalistic Imperialism and Russia are both evil, if you like?
     
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  12. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    They are people that tried to expose illegal (or at least moral) wrongdoing by the western globalist hegemony and were quickly imprisoned in much the same way that Putin does.

    We stopped short of killing them though, so I guess the west is slightly better.. right,
     
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  13. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    You’re arguing with yourself mate. I’ve never claimed that Putin isn’t evil. I completely agree with you.

    Capitalism on the other hand, you couldn’t be more wrong. It’s an incredible system. But that topic I can’t be bothered to go back over
     
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  14. ......loading......

    ......loading...... 25 undefeated

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    It is quite hard to argue with you sometimes as you aren't always fully coherent. Maybe if you tried to respond properly?
     
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  15. tomw24

    tomw24 Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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  16. StJabbo1

    StJabbo1 Well-Known Member

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    So who and what are these "globalists" surely not an anti semitic description as the Anti-Defamation League’s Jonathan Greenblatt put it, “Where the term originates from is a reference to Jewish people who are seen as having allegiances not to their countries of origin like the United States, but to some global conspiracy.” Some examples of articles and the publications in which globalist propaganda appear would help to clarify your arguments.

    Or globalist has been used in right-wing and far-right politics, and in various conspiracy theories. Perhaps the QAnon conspiracy theory referring to what they term "the Cabal" as a secret worldwide elite organisation who wish to undermine democracy and freedom, and implement their own globalist agendas suits.

    As for this interview it appears to me as an exercise in ego massaging self aggrandisement by a discredited, sidelined media has been without any likelihood of producing a solution that varies from Putin's previous rhetoric on partition or complete capitulation with, in his own words "denazification and demilitarization".
     
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  17. Saintjoey

    Saintjoey Well-Known Member

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    Genuine question…those that are historically left of centre or genuine left…is there a party at the GE that will reflect your interests?
     
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  18. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    #42798
  19. tomw24

    tomw24 Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    It's not just the comments. He made them with Brianna Ghey's mother due to be in the public gallery. By sheer chance she wasn't there at the time.
     
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  20. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    Labour seem to have all my interests covered. I recognise that Starmer is having to fight both the establishment and the lunatic left at the same time, but for me his biggest attraction is that he appears to be competent, a slur no one could accuse the Tories of,
     
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