Our first year in League One, we played; Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth, Leeds, Millwall, Norwich, Charlton, Huddersfield. All big 'names' either back then or in subsequent years. Just goes to show how quickly things can change in football. It's fun being part of the shifting forces sometimes and getting moved around by the ebb and flow of fortune. Would rather that than just finishing bottom half of the Prem every year for the rest of time.
I tend to agree with this point of view, the current bloke on the touchline making odd decisions has been in and around the first team for some time at the club so he is part of the problem with the whole culture, the belief, the way the team sets up and plays - he may not have had absolute choices in the past but he must have joined in conversations with managers/coaches. He needs to go. It probably would be best to wipe out the entire backroom staff and start again - this would mean we would not be getting promoted or probably ripping up any trees but in the long run and looking ahead I wonder if a 'tearing off the plaster approach' might be the best way - although for the poort supporters extremely frustrating for some time.
Was chatting with Leeds mates yesterday (well mostly laughing at them) and they all think we 100% will come straight back and easily have the best chance of doing so compared to the other 4 who could go down with us. Whilst we all love to rant and moan about how **** we are and how we will never be any good again I guarantee that Leeds, Leicester and Everton fans are doing exactly the same
I think bouncing straight back will be very difficult, as there are a hell of a lot of good teams in the Championship and we need a massive rebuild. The other two sides who go down with us will likely be strong, you then have all the teams currently in and around the play-offs who you’d expect to be up there again. Then you’ve got the yo-yo clubs who usually challenge for the title, but didn’t this season, in Norwich, West Brom and Watford. Given the massive rebuild we’ll have, it will be an amazing achievement to go straight back up. Pessimistic but I think we’ll be down there for a couple of seasons minimum.
I dunno, history states that only teams with financial difficulties have struggled in recent times when going down. That shouldn’t be us. Also the teams don’t look very good to me outside of Burnley and Sheff Utd. Do we really think we won’t be able to compete with Millwall, Luton, Coventry next season? There are lots of unknowns which won’t be answered til closer to the time, but right now I’d be very disappointed if we weren’t at least in the top 6 next year. That outlook may change over the summer and we see what we do
Really? There's not that many TBH. We should have one of the best squads in the division even with a number of departures. Get the right manager in and we'll be in good shape for an instant return. There's a really big gulf between the PL and Championship. Adam Armstrong is living proof of that.
I would tentatively suggest that us and Leeds would be the best equipped to come straight back up. But to be honest, it's difficult to know. Forest have had such a monumental upheaval in their squad over the past year, that there is no point even speculating what their XI might look like come September. How many of them will still be there - whether because of being on loan, or one year contracts, or stupid wages, or having zero inclination to play in the Championship? And aside from Johnson, they have few saleable assets. Everton and Leicester both have their money problems, but from the outside are probably the most attractive of the five. They also probably both have a reasonable pool of experienced players who they could probably retain - the likes of Tarkowski, Keane, Coleman, Vardy, Evans, Albrighton. Two major unknowns with those clubs is how much they could get for Maddison and Pickford. In ordinary circumstances, they could get big bucks for both of them. But Maddison only having one year left on his contract will deflate his value. And I can't believe that Pickford would have recently signed a new four year contract if it didn't include a below value relegation release clause.
Last year Huddersfield finished 3rd, now they are just above the relegation zone. Its so hard to predict the Championship. Most of the teams in the Championship rely on several loan players to improve their team. Sunderland will lose Diallo, Boro lose Archer, Ramsey, and Giles; three of their best players right now. And we don't need a massive rebuild. That's just the bedwetters' knee jerk slogan of the moment. Sure we need to thin the squad out, and get a decent manager in. But we will have a good enough team to compete, and that's without spending the 150-200m that we will recoup from player sales.
The player sales will be the key and how much we raise. The more I think about it the more o can see Lavia going back to City this summer for something like £20m, then loaned to a PL side. We make some money on him, City get him back like the plan supposedly was all along and we keep the relationship with them sweet so we can take some more of their youngsters. Chuck in another 40-50m for KWP and JWP combined and then it’s about who else goes to top the funds up
Doesn't Lavia have a £40m buyback clause? I think your listed fees are about 5 years out of date to be honest. If we got £50m for JWP and KWP I'd be fuming. It'll cost us £20m for a top championship player, those two are on the fringes of international football.
Yeah, there's zero point in selling Lavia for a penny less than £40m. And we'd be daft to (so it will probably happen).
The buyback for Lavia doesn’t kick in til 2024 so he’s open to the highest bidder this summer. If that highest bidder isn’t City then I think we can kiss goodbye to the relationship we have with them. We may be able to negotiate bringing the buyback forward a year as I doubt they want him playing in the Championship, or they may say we were going to give you £30m for developing him for 2 years, we’ll give you half of that (£15m + the £10m initially paid) and loan you *insert player name* and sell you another Bazunu/Larios/Edozie type for doing so. As I say all huge unknowns but I could see the above happening. We obviously are trying to have a good relationship with City and that will be out the window if we sell Lavia to their rivals As for KWP and JWP, doesn’t KWP only have a year left on his deal? So we don’t have much power there and £15-20m seems about right. JWP is not going to go for anymore then £30m at his age
I actually can't see the fire sale burn the house down type strategy that the miserable crew on here predict. Watford kept hold of a lot of decent players for a year and Sarr & João Pedro for 2 full championship seasons.. Who is going to look at some of our talented but in shocking form players and pay what we want for them... Players like Perraud, ABK, Sulemana, Alcaraz, Adams etc, I just can't see much of a market for with the prices we will expect. Particularly as we are flush with cash and not in much of a perilous position financially, like a lot of clubs who go down are. The only ones I'd be certain people want are those with long term proven form and that's basically just JWP, KWP and Lavia. All this chat of not being in the prem for a coming generation I just don't get. We've been a top level club for 38 of the past 45 years, that's significantly more than everyone else in the Championship next year.
Chelsea did also offer, what was it…£50m at the end of the summer window for him. No idea what we’ll do regards not damaging the Man City relationship but I’d be surprised if we let him go for less than £40m. I think they’d be fine with him staying here and buying him back the following season even tbh, just not sure he’d be up for that given he’s proven he’s already a very good PL player.
We wouldn't sell for £30m this year if we can guarantee £40m the following. No business would ever make that decision. The only alternative would be a loan to a PL/ top club with a fee and sell at the end of the season. Unless the players demand moves then the club just shouldn't sell anyone unless the price is right. We are not reliant on transfer fees for next season so I feel we actually hold quite a lot of cards regarding any transfer movement.
You might be right re Lavia, I guess it just depends how highly we value the relationship with City if someone else comes in for him. You are right that I can’t see too much of a high end market for most of our squad, so it depends what the new manager/back room team wants to do in terms of burning it all down and starting again. There would be offers for a lot of them at the right price. Our squad is also huge so we need to thin out about 10 anyway just to get to a 25 man squad from players currently on the books.
We absolutely need to thin the squad out and with a few contracts up and a loan ending that will be 4 players around the match day squad going. (AMN, Caballero, Walcott and Ely, which is £200k+ weekly wages) We have a further 4 contracts ending in 2024 so I imagine we will look to sell them as a priority (Che, Salisu, Diallo, Stu). KWP actually expires in 2025 so I expect we should look to get £25m+ for him at least. He is a bloody good player and would be an upgrade for most PL teams. So say it is those 8 + JWP, KWP and Lavia outgoing, that would free up over £600k pw week in wages and around £160-180m of transfer fees. That's a huge churn and would make us the clear financial powerhouses of the Championship. The only other club coming down from the current bottom 5 who would be close to us in terms of financials is Leeds. Leicester, Everton and Forest will be ****ed.
Selling Lavia for under £50m doesn’t make financial sense, because if we sell him to anyone besides City they get a £10m cut and their £40m buy back clause activates at the end of next season. So to be worthwhile it needs to be £50m+. I think we will get it as well, Chelsea bid £50m for Lavia the week after he played against them.
True and true. I just don’t have much faith yet in the club being competent enough to sort out the issues we have. We’ll see in the summer. The below is what I think are the minimum fees we can get for players who I think will leave. I’ve been deliberately conservative and think we’ll get more, but at the very least I’d expect; Lavia: £40m JWP: £30m ABK: £20m Salisu: £20m KWP: £15m Adams: £15m DCC: £10m Bednarek: £10m Total = £160m Some might stay, others might leave, but surely we’ll raise about £160m before we have to dip into our own transfer pot.
