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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. Toby

    Toby GC's Life Coach

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    #83481
  2. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

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    It depends whether you consider Crimea to be Russian soil or not. Russia would, of course.

    Ukrainian government warns only return to 1991 border will bring peace | Evening Standard

    We should not support Ukraine in taking back Crimea by force.
     
    #83482
  3. Staines R's

    Staines R's Well-Known Member

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    Again we’ll have disagree that it’s “just old stock”

    Ukraine weapons: What tanks and other equipment are the world giving? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-62002218
     
    #83483
  4. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

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    Was that the bloke on the Today programme, a representative of the Ukrainian Govt, who said ‘there are no good Russians’? It was a brilliant joke, I couldn’t understand why nobody laughed.
     
    #83484
    Steelmonkey and Staines R's like this.
  5. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    1997-2010 Ukraine leased the rights for the Russian Black Sea fleet to use Sevastopol as its base. Perhaps there is a compromise on Crimea there going forwards, although there is now such hatred of Russians by Ukranians as a result of so many civilian deaths, the idea of the two countries sharing anything is probably naive. Only the replacement of Putin with a more liberal Russian leader would do it, and that looks a distant prospect.
     
    #83485
  6. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Flight cancelled due to luvvies and Labour MP's and now one of these criminals has murdered someone and got 26 years.
     
    #83486
    kiwiqpr likes this.
  7. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Most of these people arrived as children in the UK and became criminals there and not in Jamaica - they have spent most of their lives there and are British in all but name. As a result of their deportation you split up families and leave countless children without a father - thereby successfully preparing the next generation of mixed up kids who can join the criminal hordes. Among those due to be deported there are,admittedly, some serious cases, but there are also people who have not reoffended in over 10 years, or got done for lesser offences many years ago. Britain cannot simply deport its problems in this way - why should Jamaica accept back somebody who first became a criminal somewhere else ? They are your responsibility. What do you seriously think a 40 year old can do in Jamaica if they haven't been there since they were 10 ?
     
    #83487
  8. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    "British in all but name". I hadn't heard that legal status before. They are not British citizens, but Jamaican nationals, and to be deported, you have to commit serious crimes. Jamaica accepts that it has a legal duty to accept them back. They are sent back on criminal court orders.

    Of course, if they get British citizenship, they won't be deported, and after Windrush, care is taken to assess whether a person is eligible. Those on the plane, including the man who has now committed a murder, apparently weren't eligible, Incidentally, his son got 22 years and 10 for robbery.
     
    #83488
  9. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    To belong to a nation in ''all but name'' means to have spent most of your life there, which may not be a legal definition but is certainly a moral one. There were/are some of the 50 who last committed crimes many years ago, and were, presumably punished then - if so then the slate is clear because you cannot, by international law, be punished for the same offence twice. I see the logic of deporting criminals but if you are going to do it then do it immediately after the offence not years later.
     
    #83489
  10. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Tell that to the Australian government who send 100s of criminals back here some of whom went to Australia as toddlers
     
    #83490

  11. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    The UK does not owe a moral duty to serious criminals!
     
    #83491
  12. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    So you would deport rather than jail someone for murder
    Money saver at least
    You could probably empty a prison or two of foreign criminals
     
    #83492
  13. rangercol

    rangercol Well-Known Member

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    That's not entirely accurate mate.
     
    #83493
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  14. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    No, I didn't say that Kiwi. Criminal courts have the power to recommend deportation as part of the sentence. The result is that a prison sentence is shorter than it would otherwise be followed by deportation - this is what happened with Boris Becker. What I said you couldn't do was to give someone the complete sentence and then deport them years later. There must be a period of time of continuous legal residence after which time deportation is not possible.
     
    #83494
  15. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    suspension seems a bit over the top

    Four Wakefield pupils suspended after Quran damaged at school
    • Published
      3 days ago
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    IMAGE SOURCE,AKEF AKBAR
    Image caption,
    The copy of the Quran was damaged in an incident at the Wakefield school on Wednesday
    Four pupils have been suspended from a West Yorkshire secondary school after a copy of the Quran was damaged by students.

    Wednesday's incident at Wakefield's Kettlethorpe High School happened when a copy of the Islamic text was brought in by a Year 10 pupil.

    Head teacher Tudor Griffiths said the book remained intact and there was "no malicious intent" from those involved.

    He held a meeting with concerned community leaders on Friday.


    Independent councillor for Wakefield East, Akef Akbar, called the meeting after being contacted by people calling for more information.

    please log in to view this image
    IMAGE SOURCE,GOOGLE
    He said reports the Quran had been burnt or destroyed were untrue, and he had inspected the book himself during the meeting.


    Mr Akbar said he had been told the book had been taken to school as a dare by a pupil who lost while playing a Call of Duty videogame with other students.

    While at the school it sustained a slight tear to the cover and smears of dirt on some of the pages.

    Mr Akbar said he understood it had been kicked around on the school premises - a claim denied by the school.

    Head teacher Mr Griffiths said in a statement: "We would like to reassure all our community that the holy book remains fully intact and that our initial enquiries indicate there was no malicious intent by those involved.

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    IMAGE SOURCE,AKEF AKBAR
    Image caption,
    Some of the pages were smudged with dirt, Mr Akbar said
    "However, we have made it very clear that their actions did not treat the Quran with the respect it should have, so those involved have been suspended and we will be working with them to ensure they understand why their actions were unacceptable.

    "This morning, we met with our local Muslim community leaders, local councillors and police to share all the information we currently know, the action taken and the immediate steps we have taken to reinforce the values and behaviour we expect from every member of this school community to ensure that all religions are respected."


    A spokesperson for West Yorkshire Police said they were "liaising" with the school.

    "Initial enquiries have confirmed minor damage was caused to the text and officers are continuing to work closely with the school," they added.
     
    #83495
  16. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    I can remember being suspended from school for smoking and this habit was only harmfull for myself whereas this would have been seen as hurtfull and insulting for other pupils, don't see how anyone can have anything against the suspension.
     
    #83496
  17. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    #83497
  18. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    no blasphemy laws in the uk yet

    would they have been suspended for not maliciously damaging a bible
    or any other book
     
    #83498
  19. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    I would hope that they would be suspended (or other appropriate action) for any malicious damage of any book which is important for other people.
     
    #83499
  20. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Head teacher Mr Griffiths said in a statement: "We would like to reassure all our community that the holy book remains fully intact and that our initial enquiries indicate there was no malicious intent by those involved.
     
    #83500
    Goldhawk-Road likes this.

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