I don't think that the timing of the appointment has helped in that respect. I've said for months that waiting until the WC break (or one week before, as it turned out) would be the wrong time to make the change. If Jones had been appointed before the season started, I suspect the number of fans openly calling for his head this early would be significantly less. But instead we're in a position where (a) over a third of the season had already passed, and (b) our immediate run of fixtures (except for Liverpool) look so important on paper. To give Jones a fair stab at the job now - ie a minimum of 15 games - essentially means that our survival hopes are reliant solely on whether he is a success or not. Lets face it, very few Saints fans would have appointed Jones. But I do think the overwhelming majority of us would be open-minded enough to give him time, if his appointment had been made over the summer. The board have made his task so much harder by the timing of his appointment.
Yes, if we stick with him with any half-reasonable length of time. But there is the "De Boer" option. Palace made that change after just four games - they accepted, very early, that they got it wrong. Made no attempt at trying to save face by sticking with him for longer. We're still three games away from even being at the half way point. If we wanted to do something similar to Palace, there would still be ample of time left for a(nother) new manager to come in and have an impact. This isn't me saying that we should take the De Boer option. But it is an option. And if we decide against taking it, then it is basically Jones or bust. I would personally prefer that he is given time. But that time should have already come, from Aug through to Dec.
I think it is a difficult situation. To be honest, I am not the least bit surprised by this as Jones effectively needed to hit the ground running to get a sceptical fan base behind him. It was inevitable, as far as I can see, that the fans would reject him if this was not to happen. We have a manager most people did not want and one whose rhetoric is not matched by the results on the pitch. As has been said, it is reallly SR's fault for appointing him. The thing that concerns me most is that this has not so much split the fans (as was the case with Ralph) but has alienated most Saints supporters extremely quickly. It is not divisive because most Saints fans can see that his appointment is wrong. Saints fans seem on the verge io uniting against Jones. However, teams who appoint 3 managers in a season rarely stay up. It is a difficult call. Personally, I cannot see Jones rescuing our season. The logic demanding Jones' head after 3 games is pretty immature although I can understand the sentiment. The next two matches will be telling. Lose those and I think the fan base will turn very hostile indeed. Watching the match yesterday at St Mary's with Jo Tessum and Adam Blackmore's commentary on at the same time seemed to underscore for me what was shockingly bad performance. Tessum has been very negative since he has come in for Dave Merrington on Radio Solent and the underlining theme was that he felt that none of the players knew what system they were supposed to be playing. I wonder how soon with Echo will also turn against Jones. I just feel that, as bitterly unfair as it may seem, Jones is not going to get a fair crack of the whip at Saints. The appointment was risky and I cannot see anything to suggest that he is an upgrade on Ralph. All the ingredients are there for a volte face by the Saints board who I feel will not be as patient with Jones as they were with Ralph. I can see a replication with what happened with Paul Sturrock and that the club will make a quick decision if things don't improve. There is no way I can see the crowd getting behind Jones even though I understand the McMemeny comparisons. For me Lawrie was undermined by senior pros like Terry Paine. I am not seeing anything from Jones to see that he has the ability to manage at this level regardless of how his squad behaves. I hope SR are pragmatic and will put their hands up if things are not working. I would hate St Marys to become a hostile and negative place where the fans get on the team's back and prevent them playing well. If the Saints fans turn against Jones, I can see the clubs making an awkward decision with the manager. I would much rather SR own up to their error than let the situation festor. If we turn things around in January, this thread might look a bit stupid in retrospect. We may have a good transfer window and climb up the table. What worries me is that former pro's like Tessum have dissected Jones' coaching abilities and found him to be wanting. This just underscores the perceptions of the fans. If you like, those professionals assessing Saints have far greater knowledge than the fan in the terrace. Tessum's appraisal was withering and does not give me much hope that Jones is the man for the job. He was not so much saying that we played poorly but rather than the players were baffled by what Jones was trying to do. Tessum was effectively suggesting that Jones was inept. For me, it is different reading that sort of comment in here by regular posters (many of whom are eloquent) to listening to a former pro who has played at that level.
Part of Lallana interview after the match ….. Adam was asked if supporters must give Jones time to implement his ideas, Lallana told Amazon Prime Video: “The fans need to stay patient, it’s never easy coming to a new club but they’ve got a good infrastructure here and a good manager. “I’ve watched a lot of his games at Luton and it’s important they give him time, as a manager it is tough.” Lallana also said: “I’ve got huge respect for everyone at this football club. When I left, both sides could probably have acted a little bit better and in hindsight, I’d like that to have been different. “But emotions are high and when things change, people move on, it’s not always nice. But it’s been nine years so I think everyone has moved on, it was nice coming back here today to a little bit of applause. “I’ve got a big affiliation with the football club, I was here for a long time and my son is in the academy now so I’m there a lot. It’s going to be tough for the but the league is so strong.” Lallana also revealed that Brighton had to make last-minute tactical changes after Jones lined up with a 4-3-3 from the start for the first time, with De Zerbi’s preparation out the window. “We were confident that Southampton would play with a back five so all our analysis was on that, but when the team sheets dropped it was a four,” he said. “We had another 10-minute meeting with where he wanted us to be and I thought my head was going to explode, but when you come onto the pitch and feel it works it’s a good feeling.”
Shades of Everton's fan base here, they didn't want Benítez, Saints fans it appears do.not want Jones. However, unlike the Toffee fans, I imagine Benítez arriving at St Mary's would be welcomed by many, and many would stick with him even if SFC is relegated.
I don’t want him sacked as I think he should be given a respectful amount of time and I want him to succeed, but it did seem a strange choice. When they said they were tracking him for months how large a net were they casting. Was he the best in large pool or a small one. I guess to get rid of Ralph would have come at a cost in severance pay did that limit who we could attract and get
You tell me!! Wages, demands to do it his way with having a say in arrivals and departures. But was Rafa ever sounded out?
Benitez would be exactly the kind of appointment who would have produced a "new manager bounce" and also fire up the imagination of the supporters. We would also be far more capable of getting better quality players to join the club. The youngsters would have been inspired by an appointment like that. I know Everton fans hated him yet he was undone by his Liverpool associations. At Southampton, it would have had a galvanising effect on the club, I am not convinced with the notion that Saints always go for the cheap option. I think our directors like to be seen to be innovative and original and see advantages with appointments which have alluded other clubs. Not sure why we are trying to emulate Brentford as our aspirations need to be much higher.
What caught my attention most, in this interview, was the last 2 paragraphs. Brighton’s plans were blown out of the water by Jones NOT playing a back 5, yet within 10 minutes their manager has ripped up their previous plan and got across to his players exactly how he wanted them to play, and they carried out his plan to perfection. That is good management. Jones, presumably, has been training and planning for us to play with a back 4 for days, yet it looked as though we were a team of pub raffle winners, getting a chance to represent their local team. I think it was Munson who posted that we need to sort the midfield out more than the defence, because that is where we are leaking goals. They offer little protection and don’t track runners. So often we face teams who, when out of possession, drop into 2 banks of 4, shutting us out and forcing us backwards. When we are out of possession we seem to fall into 2 zigzag lines allowing acres of space to pass and run through the gaps. Is it beyond the realms of possibility to get a defensive coach on board, to work on making us difficult to breakdown?
Exactly my feelings! If things continue in the same vein, Jones will be hounded out. Here's a thought - if West Ham continue in the same form, Moyes will be available soon.enough maybe not to stave off relegation but to.rebuild in the Championship. Maybe the much-feted Benítez will rock up at the London Stadium.
In his post match interview JWP said they didnt get any of the new stuff they’d be working on with Jones working on the pitch which was disappointing. Said he had been implementing lots of new ideas on the training ground and they just couldn’t get them to work yesterday. I don’t think we are completely ****ed (and neither do the bookies if you believe they are right most of the time). There is some real **** in this league which we are definitely a part of, but it is not unsalvagable with a couple of decent signings this window and Lavia and Livramento coming back soon. Hopefully the latter isn’t now ****ed because of that serious injury
Two facts coming out of yesterday’s game. The Saints v Brighton fixture is now the most played epl fixture (11) not to see a home win. All 5 wins have been away from home, with 6 draws. We have now scored 4 OGs, which means we are leading the way in the premier league this year.
Yep, I think that fostering a winning mentality is the most important thing right now and I think the players lapsed into old habits after a bright start yesterday. We were also playing a very good and confident Brighton team. It's way too early to judge Nathan's Saints yet, we will see changes in the way we play more defined at the end of January probably. I do think that he is being judged negatively already because he came from a smaller club and will have to work hard to win over the fans as opposed to a bigger name manager but he is experienced unlike Pellegrino for example and has had a good degree of success albeit at a lower level.
