Having seen what has happened since with a majority Tory Government I think it is obvious that the Lib Dems did keep the Tories under control. And any Left winger who stopped voting Lib Dem after the coalition is complicit in getting the current lot a majority.
The Lib Dems were happy to go along with Royal Mail being sold off for pennies, so they did not keep the Tories in check
You think that that is equivalent to the ****show we've had since? If you are the junior partner in a coalition you have to agree to some unpalatable stuff. If there were 50 more Lib Dems in Parliament now we would be much better off.
Actually yes, because if the Lib Dems showed any spine whatsoever instead of rolling over expecting to have their tummy tickled then the Tories might (in theory...) have had pause before going through with so much of the **** they've done since. Same goes with the Lib Dems falling in line and voting to increase tuition fees, which not only killed the Lib Dem vote for voters aged 18-30 for a generation but also showed the Lib Dems to be compliant coalition partners who were happy to sell themselves down the river so they could pretend they were responsible for the 5p plastic bag charge In comparison look at the DUP's approach to going into coalition, where they made it plain they weren't there to just get tight votes across the line and had the ability to vote against the Tory line...until the reality of what they midwifed hit home and they got battered in the polls a couple of months back, anyway
The DUP were not in a coalition though. They just accepted bribes to support the Tories. It's completely bonkers for young voters to refuse to vote Lib Dem when the consequence is to get undiluted fascist Tory. As I've said before, if more Labour voters had voted tactically for the Lib Dems then there could have been a Lib Dem Labour coalition.
It isn't bonkers, though: if you vote Tory you get Tory, while if you vote Lib Dem you get...Tory, as was the case in both 2010 and 2019 More than anything else, when a party pledges to cut tuition fees only to vote to triple them, which is exactly what the Lib Dems did in 2010, what incentive is there for younger voters to vote for somebody who agreed to put those young voters in financial penury for their adult lives after pledging to do the exact opposite? That's the same reason the 18-30 bloc switched from Labour to Lib Dem en masse in the first place, as it was Blair who brought in tuition fees and gave the Lib Dems ground to campaign on - until they had a sniff of power, then they happily vacated that ground and wondered why their vote share collapsed
This 100% Just as it is equally ludicrous for Corbynistas to spend more time attacking Starmer (and also refusing to vote Labour under his leadership) than the most corrupt, vicious and incompetent Government in living memory!
Of course, the fact that Starmer supporters made a big song and dance of how they wouldn't vote for Labour three years ago must be conveniently forgotten at all times while members of Starmer's shadow cabinet claim they weren't campaigning to get Corbyn elected against the most corrupt, vicious and incompetent government in living memory must, of course, be ignored...
You can't change history, but you can change the future. The political posturing of the past 12 years, be that dark red, light red or yellow is gone. The issue is now and the stakes are infinitely more serious for the UK.
The more people who vote LibDem in Tory seats, the less likely you are to get a Tory government because there will be fewer Tory MPs.
Exactly right. The left always make the mistake of trying to win the last war. Theories of why Corbyn lost are just theories. The only important thing is that the Tories lose next time which means voting for the candidates most likely to beat the incumbent Tory. Left wingers should hold their nose and do that.
The Lib Dems' strategy in 2019 was the more people vote Lib Dem in Labour seats and marginal seats the less likely you are to get a Tory government We got a Tory government with an increased majority thanks to that genius strategy The issue is that we had four years of the centrists sniping from the sidelines that they didn't get the neoliberal drone they wanted in charge, yet when they get who they wanted nobody is allowed to suggest there is anything wrong with their guy and if we don't fall in line it's the sidelines or worse for you - which is enough to give 'Nam flashbacks to Blair's time in charge of Labour The fact that we had the twin images of the Kinnocks at a vote count in 2017 looking on ashen-faced as Labour were on course to prevent the Tories from being able to form their own government, and from 2019 of Jess Phillips laughing when it was announced that Labour lost a handful of seats is entirely why this posturing of "You can't criticise us, you'll let the Tories in" is particularly galling So why are both the Tories and Starmer still fighting the 2019 general election?
You seem to be completely missing the point. It doesn't matter what strategy the Lib Dems are using or who is leading which party. There are many seats where only the Lib Dems can beat the Tory. All left wingers should vote accordingly. The other issue you are missing is that the situation is not symmetrical. The Lib Dems are essentially centrist Tories. Left wingers ought to prefer them to the Tories and vote accordingly. However it is much less obvious that Lib Dem voters would necessarily prefer Labour over the Tories.
You're the one missing the point because I have stated why the Lib Dems are not appealing to left-wing voters: because they lumbered us with the Tories in the first place which is enough reason to not to vote for them because of reasons, while voters in the 18-30 bracket sure as hell won't be quick to forgive the Lib Dems shrugging their shoulders and dumping them into penury for their adult lives for having the nerve to go to university That latter point, coincidentally, if why Labour lost the 18-30 block to the Lib Dems under Blair as the Student Loans Company we gracious enough to send an annual reminder of what Blair gave to them, just as the Lib Dems lost that block back to Labour for going along with Tory plans to triple tuition fees at a time where Labour were promising the opposite So, why would somebody who has been laden with debt by the Lib Dems, with Ed Davey being one of those to vote for the increase in tuition fees, forget all about how they have no chance of buying a house before they're 273 years old when it comes to the polls? The issue is that the polls are currently offering the choice of who has shafted you the least, and how is that going to appeal to anybody? That's literally the tagline for the first Alien vs Predator film, FFS Take this, for example So much to unpack there, not least how it's a press conference without the press involved until they're handed a press release afterwards is somehow worse than Theresa May's secret election campaigning, but mainly how is this saying "You're getting the same **** that the Tories have dumped on you, but I'm scared of Leave voters in Hartlepool" going to appeal to literally anyone other than the straw Leave voters that Starmer is assuming will switch back to Labour if he sounds Tory enough? Which, ironically enough, is also an example of centrists fighting the 2019 GE
I will make it simple. If you lived in my constituency would you vote for Layla Moran? Or would you waste your vote on the Labour candidate and let the Tory in? Everything else is irrelevant.
No, you haven't made it simple at all, as you're acting as if Moran didn't get a majority of just under 9000 in 2019 But let's talk about your MP for a second, shall we? Layla Moran stood to be Lib Dem leader in 2000, after Jo Swinson was presumably shoved off the nearest pier, with her platform being based on education, environment, and not only ruling out a coalition with the Tories while also stating that a coalition with Labour would require guarantees of electoral reform but also admitting the coalition was a disaster for the country because of <<gestures out of the nearest window>> Davey stood saying the coalition was marvelous and ruled out working with Labour Davey got almost 2/3 of the vote due to being the most Tory-like candidate Which takes us right back to why, exactly, the option of voting for who has shafted you the least is supposed to appeal to voters. And, no, "You're enabling the Tories!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" is not a valid response
