Well done to you Liverpool fans for showing great passion on the tour of the city yesterday, and the restraint shown despite the belligerence of the authorities and provocation from the street. In a way, you have triumphed from the defeat.
don't agree. it was well over before any of the real stuff started. LFC put no energy though salah, mane et al playing that comp. we lost the league v city at their stolen commonwealth games stadium but in truth a draw away in any other year would be good. the thing was all but gone before January and we played no seniors in the league cup then. we lost the CL final by playing not to lose and within our safe space. it wasn't brave. I have to agree though. its a complete and total anomaly across europe and should not have a European slot. the problem is its an efl slush fund for the nobs in that league to harvest money out of 5 match days in particular so they can have a nice slush fund for thier trips and expenses. As long as city and cheslea use it as an ego trip theres an issue to keep up with jones.
Did anyone find it odd that the BT coverage didn't once show any Liverpool fans or 'dignitaries' (whatever you like to call them, ex-players etc.) up close like they kept doing with Madrid? Not a single close up of a player on the pitch during play - it was like the Benzema, Vinicius, Casemiro show with other guests invited along. The whole event from beginning to end was very surreal. Last time we lost to Real it felt like we'd just lost a huge game. This time it's like we entered a weird time warp and none of it really happened. If we'd won it would have felt bitter sweet with the disgraceful treatment of the fans. And I also forgot to say in a previous post that the Liverpool team bus was delayed en route as well in addition to the fans being kettled.
Can't recall many but there was a close up of Rush. Plus Gerrard and Owen were pundits with Mcmanaman commentating.
They're just the usual commentators though with Gerrard as special guest because of the connection. Didn't see close up of Rush. Was surprised they didn't have two Real players bringing the cup out
Liverpool fans’ Paris nightmare: Do the French sports and interior ministers’ claims stack up? please log in to view this image By Simon Hughes May 31, 2022 150 Last night, Liverpool chairman Tom Werner sent a letter to the France’s sports minister Amelie Oudea-Castera asking her to apologise for her comments about the supposed causes of a 37-minute delay to the start of the Champions League final in Paris on Saturday night. Earlier on Monday, Oudea-Castera and French interior minister Gerald Darmanin held a press conference where they blamed “British fans” for arriving late to the Stade de France, despite the enormous photographic and video evidence to the contrary. The pair also blamed “fake tickets”, claiming there were as many as 40,000 in circulation around the northern outskirts of Paris, near where the ground is located. Here, The Athletic looks at each of those claims, which do not align with the conclusions of Matthieu Valet, a spokesperson for France’s Independent Union of Police Commissioners, who believes local youths were responsible for causing the disruption… French interior minister Gerald Darmanin: “At 21:00 (Paris time, 8pm in the UK), when the match was supposed to start, 97 per cent of the Spanish supporters were present, only 50 per cent of the British supporters had got into their section, which does show the difficulties that arose only from the entrance relating to the Liverpool supporters and not the other entrances.” Does this stack up? While the numbers might tell the truth, the respective access points allocated to the two clubs made it easier for Real Madrid fans to get into the stadium. This, however, ignores the reality that Madrid fans faced their own problems at security, with their supporters telling Spanish media about their anger at dismal policing, stolen tickets and violent attacks on their way to the game, as well as on their way out after it. Before kick-off, while Madrid fans came from the north, from their fan park at Parc de la Legion d’Honneur just 1.5km away, and passed through a ticket checkpoint where there was lots of space and enough stewards and police to deal with any approach, the geography at the other end of the ground, where Liverpool supporters were meant to be situated at kick-off time, invited huge challenges. There were far more than just the 20,000 fans for the Liverpool section of the stadium travelling from the centre of Paris, because many thousands of fans with tickets in the neutral parts of the ground, as well as some Real fans who did not attend their fan zone, and journalists, used the same RER line and the same Metro stop. From that station, there was just one route to the “Stade”, which was supposed to take 17 minutes but for many took as long as three hours. From the Metro, Liverpool fans, Real Madrid ones and “neutrals” were directed to a narrow passageway on the side of a dual carriageway where police vans clogged up lots of space. Three hours before kick-off, the build-up had already reached an uncomfortable level. The Athletic writers James Pearce and Oliver Kay travelled to the match separately but had exactly the same experiences. Concerned about the pressure in the crowd, both managed to climb over a barrier before approaching the Stade de France. please log in to view this image please log in to view this image please log in to view this image please log in to view this image please log in to view this image please log in to view this image please log in to view this image After walking around the stadium to reach the accreditation centre, it became clear Madrid fans were not facing the same geographical issues. The Athletic’s Caoimhe O’Neill, who approached the stadium via the Madrid end because her ticket was in a neutral zone, experienced two ticket checks, one by the police and another by stewards. Ultimately, the French authorities do not seem to have acknowledged that there were very different arrangements in place at the two ends of the stadium. They might have felt they had reason to make different arrangements for the respective fanbases. But if that was the case, that should be made clear. Darmanin: “There was massive fraud to an industrial level and organisation of fake tickets because the pre-filtering by the Stade de France and the French football federation saw that 70 per cent of tickets were fake.” Does this stack up? By simple mathematics this is impossible, because it would mean more than 40,000 fake tickets were in circulation. For the authorities to know that, in a three-hour period, even the low end of this estimate would require 167 people to be trying to get in illegally per minute. That’s roughly three per second. There’s no doubt there were some fake tickets in circulation, but the numbers the French government are talking about do not seem remotely credible. Dan Nicolson, who has run big events aimed at Liverpool’s fanbase, says the claim is absurd: “To shift tens of thousands of units of anything in just three weeks is exceptional business. If you’re doing that offline without retail outlets you’d need a network of at least 500 willing people doing an average of 80 tickets each.” If a forged ticket operation were to be launched online instead, Nicolson believes scammers would need a fulfilment service to rival some of Europe’s biggest e-commerce operations, while avoiding the attention of the authorities over a three-week period. “It isn’t happening,” he said. please log in to view this image Ticket-holding Liverpool fans were forced to wait outside the Stade de France (Photo: Getty) Darmanin: “Once through the pre-filtering stage, 15 per cent of tickets were fake, more than 2,600 were non-validated tickets even though they’d gone through the first filtering.” Does this stack up? The French interior minister would have this information had the security operation not collapsed two hours before kick-off when stewards in many areas gave up on checking tickets. At the first ticket checkpoint at the Liverpool end, thousands were let through with no ticket checks one hour and 20 minutes before kick-off as the authorities lost control of their own operation — seemingly in an attempt to release pressure because of the huge queues that had developed over the previous three hours. I was there when this happened and my ticket was not validated until I reached the first gate. I have since been told by other fans that scanning devices used to validate mobile-phone tickets at the failed checkpoint stopped working and this meant the authorities were not able to regulate who was entering efficiently, adding to the subsequent delays at the gates. The numbers here would suggest a huge number of people were being turned away at the pre-filtering stage. Our Oliver Kay was waiting at a checkpoint for nearly an hour when tickets were being inspected and he didn’t see a single person being turned away. A friend says he was held there for two hours and only saw about 10 people turned away with fake tickets. His colleague James Pearce, meanwhile, has friends who were in possession of genuine tickets only to be told they were fake. They wouldn’t scan after three or four attempts. Darmanin: “The massive presence of these fake tickets was the issue which meant there were delays. There were 29 arrests that took place within the Stade de France and more than half of those arrests were British supporters because they’d intruded inside the Stade de France.” Does this stack up? Various numbers have emerged since Saturday evening. The French media reported then that there had been 105 arrests. Now, they are suggesting there were 29 within the stadium and that “more than half” of those arrested were British. So far, it has not explained why these people were arrested. The background of the non-British arrests has not been revealed, either. It is clear from video footage, widely available on social media, that there were locals who got into the stadium without tickets. There have also been numerous accounts of fans of both clubs being set upon by gangs believed to be from the area surrounding the Stade de France. Two flare-ups Oliver Kay witnessed outside the ground both involved locals rather than fans of either club. Valet, spokesperson for France’s Independent Union of Police Commissioners, spoke about “professional thugs, mostly minors” who “wanted to break into the stadium and give the police a hard time”. Fans who were at the turnstiles have said similar. But the French government has glossed over this. French sports minister Amelie Oudea-Castera: “The major central point is to really understand precisely what happened during this massive fraud as far as the ticketing is concerned. There are witnesses of this and figures corroborate that 30,000 to 40,000 without tickets or with fake tickets. The fake tickets looked incredibly like normal tickets, which meant some controls didn’t notice it.” Does this stack up? Of course, it’s important to understand what happened. And that applies not just to the “massive fraud” Oudea-Castera claims but to the inadequate security arrangements which were undoubtedly a very significant factor in the chaos. Late on Monday night, UEFA announced an “independent report” would be carried out by Dr Tiago Brandao Rodrigues, a Portuguese MP. A UEFA statement suggested that evidence “will be collected from all relevant parties”. For this to be done comprehensively, this will surely have to involve consultation with the thousands upon thousands of fans and media who were held up at the first “pre-filtering” point where lots of the problems began. (Additional contributors: James Pearce, Oliver Kay, Caoimhe O’Neill) (Top photo: Thomas Coex/AFP via Getty Images)
And apparently, now the French Football Federation has jumped in with the claim that it was 35k people at the stadium without tickets or with forged tickets because...... the total number they estimate traveled to the ground by train, bus, taxi (?) and foot was 110k, and the ground holds 75k. No explanation is given as to how this figure is derived at, but if true, it can surely be substantiated by CCTV (if they don't destroy it first as SYP did). So, a question - what happened to this extra 35k then? There certainly wasn't 35k more in the ground - in fact, the Liverpool end never looked full at all, even though gates had been opened eventually and anybody could get in. There wasn't 35k outside the ground at halftime - CCTV will prove that, as will the news reports from cameras filming outside the ground after the bogus horseshit of fans turning up late. So does that mean the 35k went back to Paris? If so, surely the same counting methods employed to come up with 110k figures in the first place would validate the claim they did just that as soon as they couldn't get in? Dogshit, innit? Utter, utter, drivel of the type SYP got away with, even after the Taylor Report exposed them as lies. Just hope, as well as what the club is doing now to compile evidence and reports, they'll use their financial and legal muscle to fire off injunctions to preserve evidence. This must end in a lawsuit against UEFA and the French authorities. Sue them for every penny of damages we can get, and give the money to the food banks in this country. UEFA scum indeed.
This is the same video seen in the Mail (and on the Prem Board) as evidence of how Liverpool were 'Up to their old tricks'.
You lot need to work together with Real on this. Rangers & Frankfurt have for organisational issues with the EL and I think you stand a much better chance if doing so together and emphasising that Madrid fans suffered similar issues. I believe that some UEFA sponsors did also so hopefully that'll push them to not be able to ignore it? Disgusting the behaviour of the French authorities and the lies which have been said since. Have UEFA even retracted/apologised for the 'late fans' announcement on the screen which was disproven almost instantly? Pathetic. Also very sad to see how many people are willing to lap up the narrative. Literally loads of respected journalists were also caught up in it and there's vast video evidence and yet people are happy with the 'Blame the English' excuses. Doesn't even take much research to see what happened. Those excuses are especially ironic coming from France in the same weekend as that St Etienne incident (and the state of French football in general), imagine the headlines if that had happened here ffs
Well said. It's a pure right wing paris fascist politician throwing smears to protect his right wing fascist police friends. In short France should be completely blackmailed for hosting anything now.
Libby, never mind UEFA - I posted on the Prem matchday thread at halftime that the late arrival and fans climbing the gates stories were drivel, and showed the social media videos and posts as evidence: I got nothing but dog's abuse and replies of 'Hillsborough', 'Heysel', 'It's never their fault', and all the rest as the chief goblin troll in charge on there organised the pile-on. Now I don't mind nor avoid banter about the game and the result - that's fair enough. But what I'm saying is you're the exception, not the rule - the majority of fans in England are not interested in any evidence or truth. They've got their bait already from that initial UEFA headline, and they aren't going to take any contradiction to that. And that includes UEFA too - it's a bit like asking SYP to do an 'independent' inquiry into Hillsborough after they deliberately lied about gates being broken down, hordes of ticketless fans assaulting the police, and trying to destroy all the CCTV evidence (this all sound familiar?). It's pleasing that Madrid and many, many French officials and politicians are opposing the ministry and UEFA narrative, but I don't expect great things from a report (not an inquiry) carried out by one of the principal protagonists - and, specifically, a party that will probably be finding itself on the sharp end of several lawsuits by clubs, fans, and sponsors for the next decade if it is honest about what it finds. As said, can you imagine what the Taylor Report would have looked like if the FA and SYP had written it? We get an idea when we see Popper's original inquest, which we now know was interfered with by both SYP and the Thatcher cabinet.
