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The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Tottenham Hotspur' started by Wandering Yid, Feb 9, 2016.

  1. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    ^members of NATO ^guaranteed military protection by the :

    1. USA
    2. EU

    which do you believe the Baltic states would more or less happy with ??
     
    #19541
  2. Alfie Conn

    Alfie Conn Well-Known Member

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    The cynic in me is thinking Jonson will use the Ukrainian conflict as his Thatcher / Falklands moment to head off party gate
     
    #19542
  3. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    If Thatcher had been paid off by the Argentinian junta.
     
    #19543
    Left on the Shelf likes this.
  4. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Good. They were a ****ing embarrassment and virtually opposed to the party.
    Getting called out by your own Scottish branch for posting bollocks is humiliating.
     
    #19544
  5. KingHotspur

    KingHotspur Well-Known Member

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  6. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    America did not bomb Somalia recently, unless I missed something.
     
    #19546

  7. KingHotspur

    KingHotspur Well-Known Member

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    From what I read, they bombed them on Tuesday and announced it on Wednesday. Apparently no casualties but still.
     
    #19547
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  8. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Is this a reference to them drone striking terrorists who had attacked Somalian security forces?
    The same terrorist group that suicide bombed a restaurant there last week, killing 14 people?
     
    #19548
    Left on the Shelf likes this.
  9. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Joe Biden has nominated Ketanji Brown Jackson to the Supreme Court of the US.
    She will massively divide opinion amongst millions of people, most of whom will never have heard of her.
    I certainly haven't and have absolutely no insight to offer whatsoever.
     
    #19549
  10. vimhawk

    vimhawk Well-Known Member

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    I believe they are very happy to be protected by Article 5 which is the one about collective self-defence. If Russia attacks any of them it's legally the same as attacking all 30 members. Clearly NATO isn't perfect, for example there may be consequences from having Greece and Turkey as members, but it is still better than countries acting alone or with individual defence treaties. Also the US + UK + EU isn't the same as NATO and the EU is not a military organisation and as far as I'm aware doesn't have control over the military assets of any member states. Put it this way, I'd rather have a German commitment to NATO via Article 5 than via the EU (as currently constituted), Germany has significant economic ties to Russia that might affect it's decision making.
     
    #19550
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  11. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    You haven't answered the question, and no prevarication can evade it.

    Since May 1945, the *USA* has been the miltary
    "lender of last resort" in western Europe.
    Not the UK, Not the EU. Not anyone else.

    So on that basis, if as a nation under threat from a big
    fish like Russia, and the opportunity comes, why would I
    not form treaty directly with the organ grinder rather
    than additionally with the bunch of dancing monkeys
    who delude themselves that they are the organ grinder ??
     
    #19551
  12. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    I'm happy to answer that and I think that there are two answers.
    The first is that the US doesn't enter into many of them, so it may not be an option.
    The other is that the US might abandon it if your country isn't worth the hassle.

    Korea probably feel quite safe with theirs, due to the fairly weak fruitcake to their North.
    Taiwan? Not so much.
     
    #19552
  13. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    Well now is the test for the USA,
    Show Putin via treaty that Ukraine will not join NATO, because it won't need to.

    If the UK, EU want to do similar with Ukraine so the latter
    can "hedge the bets" , all good with me,


    "Korea probably feel quite safe with theirs, due to the fairly weak fruitcake to their North.
    Taiwan? Not so much"

    Taiwan are fortunate to have the USA as a defender.
    If only for the fact they are VLSI fab central. If that ever changes ....
     
    #19553
  14. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Eric Zemmour is a far-right French pundit turned wannabe politician.
    He harks back to the past, hates immigrants and pushes dodgy conspiracies.
    He also cheated on his wife and knocked up his much younger assistant.
    I can't think why he's sharing an opinion with Farage...
     
    #19554
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  15. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    This isn't about Ukraine joining NATO.
    It's a pretence that's being pushed. Pure Russian propaganda.
    I've lost track of the number of times that I've seen the claim that Russia would be boxed in by it.
    Ukraine on one side, the US on the other with only 11 time zones between them! <laugh>
     
    #19555
  16. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    Then by definition such a treaty with the USA
    would "kill two birds with one stone" .
     
    #19556
  17. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Do you have anything that suggests that the USA would enter into such a treaty?
    Why would Putin treat it any differently, even if that were an option?
     
    #19557
  18. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    I have no evidence whatsoever that the current USA administration
    gives a toss about Ukraine.


    "Why would Putin treat it any differently, even if that were an option?"

    You act based on how likely you think the other big
    fish is likely to take a chunk out of you if you kick off.

    Putin is likely looking at what he perceives to be a senile
    old fish with probably none of its prime adult teeth remaining.
     
    #19558
  19. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Ah, Fox News. That explains it.
    Ukraine would be a lot better off if the guy gargling Putin's balls was still in charge, right?
     
    #19559
  20. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member Forum Moderator

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    Also applies to Sweden.
    Russia's dictating everyone's decisions now, apparently.
     
    #19560

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