Ive tried to talk to a friend about it. Pointless he just says “it’s my hobby”. **** hobby if you ask me but each to their own.
Pedantic issue first. It’s not a question of “showing signs” it’s a question of does the person have the virus or not. If a person isn’t infected then they can’t transmit it. If a person is vaccinated then they have a better chance of not being infected and, therefore, of not transmitting the virus. Therefore, the argument for vaccination is that 1. You are less likely to be infected and, therefore, less likely to transmit it to others. Once you are infected then you are just as likely to transmit the virus regardless of whether you are vaccinated or not. 2. You reduce the risk of needing treatment yourself especially hospital treatment thereby reducing the demand on an overworked NHS. 3. You reduce the risk of others needing treatment especially hospital treatment thereby reducing the demand on an overworked NHS. Vaccination is not just about yourself but thinking of others as well. That is why some people are saying those choosing not to be vaccinated are selfish.
Mini-conclusion here; a similarity of Conspiracy theorists and Politicians is a pre-set/already cemented-in ideological certainty. No amount of attempted dialogue will lead to any result other than that they are right and you are undoubtedly wrong. And you’re blind. You’re a sheep. You’re part of the problem. Lesson; don’t engage with them voluntarily. (we can put this at the end of that chapter in the book)
I think Cans articulated that well - and it complicates things, because - for me - there is a lot of truth in the individual rights being viewed through a collective responsibility lens. The 2 viewpoints (what one man wants v what public health needs) don’t share the bed comfortably.
Aye live your life. Ignore everyone trying to tell you what to do, or why you need to believe something. There are better things to do with your time. If there is one thing this pandemic has solidified it’s that. People have become lost in conspiracy theories and opinions presented as fact on the BBC/websites/forums. It’s been a fertile time for such things.
I think a sane man will live half his day with his brain functioning, the other half just engaged with his 5 senses
It’s just opinion what he’s presented though. He may present it as fact just like the BBC but it isn’t. Context is important too. How much it reduces transmission or infection is open to debate. If it’s minimal I don’t think that’s a good enough reason to go all Nazi on folk. That’s just my personal opinion too of course, and each is entitled to their own.
Aside from you presenting opinion as fact, it actually does matter. That ethical issue has just been roughshod over is all.
Except 1 It is a fact that some vaccinated people believe those not getting vaccinated are selfish. 2 That is exactly what I said. 3 It’s true. That some vaccinated people believe those not getting vaccinated are selfish. Getting a bit touchy Pouchy ? The rest of what I said in that previous post is factually correct and doesn’t comment on the ethics aspect.
There’s many things the anti vac people differentiate on a choice basis. It just baffles me what their reasoning is? I always say it comes back to politics. People are choosing not to vaccinate because they have been told it’s a good thing to do. So… I’m not doing that. A rebel without a cause. They spout I’m not putting that **** into my system. I don’t know what’s in it. You breathe don’t you. You don’t know what **** your breathing in. Smoke eh. What’s in it? Drink alcohol daily. Hmm. Take social drugs. Wtf? Microwave meals…… I could go on. When I asked my mate why he’s not taking the VAC he said he choose not to. But why! My choice. But why choose not to? Because I can? See my problem with it. He isn’t choosing not to tell it because of any facts. Buy because he’s an awkward person who likes to go against the norm. He’s also on the dark web. So my conclusion it is mostly propaganda of the negative sort which is exactly the same as the government are spouting. Just fits one persons purpose.
But I think it’s broadly accepted medical opinion - which I’m happy to run with. I won’t give the opposite opinions the same status because they are not presenting me with public health protection advice; they are presenting me with the ‘why do anything they tell us’ advice. I have no reason to believe that the global agreement by the majority of medical professionals (that vaccines work in tandem with other steps to alleviate the worst effects of covid on society) is anything other than sincere and evidence based. My viewpoint is impacted by personal and family experiences of Covid - everyone will have had a different last 18 months and it will influence them.
Never do mate. But you’re just wriggling again. You said it doesn’t matter how they’ve come to that conclusion. “Doesn’t matter why or how they came to believe the non vaccinated are selfish.” It actually does. It’s unethical to coerce people on such subjects. I’m sure this was borne out at some point in history…we developed a code or something.
It makes me wonder why people don’t want to “really” take the Vaccination. What is the main reason. Ask that question to them and they generally don’t have a valid reason in my own eyes. If that reason is it’s my choice I don’t accept that as an informed reason.
You touch on a good point. Before people get on their high horse about being selfish, they should look inwardly rather than being brainwashed into repeating what they saw on the news. If you drink, smoke, eat unhealthy foods, you’re instantly a massive hypocrite. You put yourself at a known risk every day and unlike the effectiveness of vaccines, there isn’t any debate about that. You increase the risk of something which is putting more strain on the NHS than Covid could ever dream of.
Someone’s going to have to apologise to the Mods for us being off-topic. (I’m not doing it cos I was guilty of the same thing yesterday already)
Why though? Do you think someone has the right to smoke or drink if they want to? Do you ever drink? Why if so if you know it’s puts you at risk of needing a hospital visit? Do you consider yourself selfish for doing so?
I guess there is a fine line between scientific facts and persuasive coerce! Either way I want to understand exactly why they don’t want to take the vaccination. Is it just because they don’t want to be led to the slaughter as they say.
