Steve was shocked and so was I. It's totally unfair the criticism that Bruce is getting. He has produced the best football I've seen a Sunderland side play (my first game was in 1991) when I was old enough to get a proper interest in football. With the 3 pronged attack of Bent, Welbeck and Gyan we played some fabulous stuff and got some good results. It is not Bruce's fault that: 1. Bent wanted to leave 2. Ferguson wanted to recall Welbeck 3. Gyan wanted to leave 4. Bramble acted like a prat 5. A silly offer was made for Henderson Bruce should be given credit for: 1. Finding Sessegnon from out of the blue 2. Finding Mignolet from out of the blue 3. Managing to prize Brown and O'Shea from Manchester United. If anybody was at the game on Saturday they know how good Brown really is. 4. Spotting the potential of Welbeck and giving him a chance. I think the unfair criticism is down to the fact that the Mags are doing well and Bruce's Geordie connections. It sticks in my throat that we lost pathetically in the Carling Cup at Brighton (I was there and it was a horrible journey home) and that we have spent mega money. I'm not a fan of 4-5-1 but it did work on Saturday. We need to give Bruce time and most importantly our support. Anybody who calls for him to go needs to give their head a shake and get into the real world. There were no calls on Saturday at the match - nor should their be. Fans should not be so naive that we will go top as we have spent a lot, nor should they think we will go top just because Quinn makes some positive noises. Wake up people!
No one is doubting his ability to unearth good players (this is partly down to his scouting network) Its his tactical ineptness thats the problem! And just coz this is the best its been for a long time does that mean we should settle for it when weve been promised a side that will push for europe and participate and take seriously the cups? I like Bruce as a person but as a manager his rubbish mate and has done nothing to suggest hes gonna even try and win us anything and is that not the whole point, to try and win something? Ive changed my mind on liking him as a person infact as im sick of his ****e excuses and look what ive done for you quotes and slagging off the fans so he can **** off the sooner the better for me! Just my opinion! FTM
Cant wait to see Cest reply to this..... Put your tin hats on people! I agree with the points on here, but it is also true that Bruce has made some mistakes. The reason I still say Bruce in, is cause the alternatives have their own faults as well - not because i believe bruce is the best manager evaaar. We should remember that the 3rd season of a manager is often a transitional season (Moyes finished 17th in his 3rd season, the board stuck with him and they have, with one exception, been top 8 ever since)
BiB V Bob.... Ho hum.... I'm stuck in the middle on my opinion about Bruce. so keeping out of this... But if your happy, good for you...but many aren't, and i can see their point also.
This is a good point and im under no illusions that an instant fix is to change the manager so if we did get rid then i think the club would have to spend big and get in a very good manager with a good track record! Id rather we spent big on the manager first and get that right! Im absolutely baffled at some of Bruces tactics and substitutions at times! The guy hasnt got a clue how to motivate a group of people, cant even motivate himself on the side line and i for one am sick of looking at him!
I say give him another season or until January, we need to accept we are just another West Brom/Wolves/Stoke/ in this league so we should be in and around mid table come the end of the season with a little flirt with relegation thrown in there. Give Bruce another window in January to buy players, which we actually need (Left back/Centre back/Left Mid & striker or 2), if he doesnt adress the left flank then I will quite happily tell him to **** off come February.
I think he has balls as a manager. Even after going 2 goals down he stood by the touchline under the looks of the watching fans and didnt try to hide (Mclaren and his brolly...). I have no idea what happened at Norwich, the team just never woke up but at least against WBA the team had enough spirit to fight back and salvage a point. I guess its all about perception, the truth is in the eye of the beholder and all that.
Reality check needed Where would you have expected us to be at this stage of the season looking at our fixtures - with a sensible head on - at the beginning of the season Liverpool - 0 pts away against top six team who have spent heavily Newcastle - 1 pt local derby traditional never done well Swansea - 1 pt promoted team early season away from home - traditionally difficult fixtures everyone says - would be different mid season Chelsea - 0 pts expected result against argueably the best team in the league (3-0 at Stamford Bridge was a one off - deserved - abboration) Stoke - 3pts at home and has been a good fixture for us recently would expect to beat Norwich - 1 pt exactly as per Swansea West Brom - 3pts at home would expect to beat although we lost to them last year We would have expected 9 points and a better goal difference That would have put us where - in 8th place - 3 points behind the top 6 and 4 points above relegation. Would everyone be extatic then? No it's what you would expect It's 7 games into a new season with a team that has had 10 changes in personel plus another in on loan and thefefore needs time to gel - plus 2 enforced changes to that intended personnel in Gyan & Bramble I will agree that Bruce's sometimes has strange substitutions, and insistence in playing people out of position is annoying and has not given us yet an effective left side. but what has he given us and what will he probably give us by the end of this season will be - mid table security and slow improvemnt - i. e. exactly what his brief was when he was employed THO - tin hat on
It's totally unfair the criticism that Bruce is getting. He has produced the best football I've seen a Sunderland side play (my first game was in 1991) when I was old enough to get a proper interest in football. With the 3 pronged attack of Bent, Welbeck and Gyan we played some fabulous stuff and got some good results. If you truly do believe that the ****e we are currently watching under Bruce is better than the two 7th placed finishes under Peter Reid and the players such as Sorensen, Gray, Summerbee, Johnston, Quinny, Bally, SKP, Makin, Reyna, Schwarz and McCann (all of whom would waltz into a Bruce team), then I cant discuss the point with you mate. Those 3 years under Reid when we got back to the EPL were the best I have seen since 1975. Period. We played football that was on another planet form anything I had seen before or since and the SOL was a magical place to be with full house 48,000 capacity crowds and scintillating football. The SOL was a fortress that was rarely breached. Under Bruce, we are an easy touch. That period of time was the best I have witnessed in my 37 seasons and compared to the sub standard rubbish offered currently, its a million miles away? You can have 3 wins in 12 games at home and 3 consecutive derby humiliations. I prefer to remember the great Reid years, stuffing Chelsea and everyone else that ventured into the SOL. in magical atmospheres and partisan noisy crowds. I prefer to recall the consecutive away derby wins 2-1 and the esteem with which we were held. You can keep Bruce mate. He isn’t even as good as some of the duck eggs we have had in the past 30 years, let alone one of the best. I'll pray for a saviour to keep us up, you can look forward to relegation with your man.
Sorry like but how long are we gonna use the old players need time to gel bullshit? We got most of the squad very early in the transfer window and most of which are time served premiership pros! look at QPR they have brought in loads of new players and they seem to play with belief and determination and at times some great football, Newcastle are the same! How long are you gonna listen to the excuses?
told ya... the OP has rose tinted specs on, and cest has dark (doom and gloom) specs on. @cest, how many derbies did Reid win, how many did he lose? The footie against stoke and even WBA (except the defence) was good stuff imo. maybe not as good as Reid's team at their peak, but not as bad as you make out thats for sure.
I'll try and respond honestly to each of your 9 points 1) True but he has had 8 months to get a replacement (and plenty of funds) and he failed to do that 2) When a player joins on loan you shouldn't base your hopes around him, danger of doing the same with Bendtner IMO. A loan is a loan. 3) Gyan said in May he wasn't happy at Sunderland. Even if he then told Bruce he was happy, he should have been out the door early in the summer for those comments. 4) Fair point. Possibly ask why Turner is the first choice backup centre back, lack of cover. Letting Ferdinand go surely a bad move. 5) Again, he was given the money to reinvest and most people will agree that Bruce could have bought 2 or 3 players of equal quality to Henderson for 20 million 1 & 2) That's credit to the scouting system, Bruce didn't find them. We praise Graham Carr for our signings, not Alan Pardew. 3) Fair point. Could possibly question why Fergie was willing to let them go, perhaps niggling injuries or he knew they were on the way out, but I'll give you that one. 4) Doesn't take a huge amount of brains to figure out that a Manure player and England under 21 international has potential.
I'm still a Bruce in MJ but even I can see the odd flaw in your argument. Like Cest I well remember those Reid days and would give my right arm to have them back. Like you I dont blame Bruce for Bents departure but do blame Bruce and Quinn for not having a replacement by now. The real thin I disagree with is the, Wake up and smell the coffee, thing. Its that I know I'm right and you daft buggers are wrong that kills any debate. I would suggest we are all right in thinking what we feel if thats what we feel, we just have differing opinions. I also feel that in or out we all share a lot of opinions, its just the outer edges where we differ.
For a side widely tipped for top 8, to expect draws against 2 promoted teams is EXTREMELY conservative. Also let's be totally honest. You were massively confident about the derby, most had that as a nailed on win. I'd say closer to 13-15 points you would have expected by now.
If we are bottom 3 after 10 games Syd and with say 8 points (I cant see us getting more than 2 in the next 3 games to be honest) will you at least admit that we are in a relegation fight? Its that 'wake up and smell the coffee' bit I'm refering to because too many fans are currently sleepwalking into one without a care inthe world.
I'd have said 11 points. Liverpool - 0 Mags - 1 (agree about the poor home record stopping all 3) Swansea - 3 (They are poor) Chelsea - 0 Stoke - 3 Norwich - 1 (they are strong at home and have better players than Swansea) WBA - 3 (they are one of the worst teams I've seen in a long time) Also, in those 11 points achieved, I'd have wanted to see a steady, consistent performance from a settled balanced team after 28 months in charge and 5 transfer windows. I've seen none of the above to be honest or anywhere near it either.
Liverpool 1 - 1 Sunderland Sunderland 0 - 1 Newcastle Swansea 0 - 0 Sunderland Sunderland 1 - 2 Chelsea Sunderland 4 - 0 Stoke Norwich 2 - 1 Sunderland Sunderland 2 - 2 WBA This is not the form of a team destined for a comfortable mid table finish let alone a push for european places which we have been told is the aim! This is the form of a team destined for relegation and added to the latter half of last season it is shambolic form! I expected: Nothing from Liverpool, we should of had revenge against the geordies in our own back yard and here i expected 3 points, i expected to beat Brighton, i expect to beat Swansea, dont expect points from Chelsea game, actually thought and expected at least a draw from Stoke but was suprised but 2 of these goals were dubious and they had just came back from a european game a few days earlier, expected to beat Norwich and WBA especially after seeing how gash they have been at the beginning of the season! So thats 13 points that i expected by this point in the season, now i will except an allowence of maybe 2 points deducted to allow for some bad luck in a game we are expected to win so that leaves 11 points which i believe should have been the minimum we should have by now to be anywhere near avoiding another relegation fight of a season! I think were ****ed if we persist with this ****in joke fool of a manager!
I think the League form has been poor rather than drastically bad. It is the cup defeat that compounds it, especially with Bruce saying he hoped to win the tournament. Playing without a striker is something an under 13's sunday league manager wouldn't do, and it was clearly the wrong decision.
