This is a problem which has bugged me for a long time, people calling for managers to be sacked when actually they have very little control over what happens once the game begins. Yesterday, Sean Dyche would have received a phone call from either Carl Dickinson or the medical personnel at the club saying that Carl could not play due to illness. He would then have to shuffle his back 4 in a major way. He chose to put Doyley at LB, Marriappa at RB and bring Mirfin into CB. This is a huge decision to make a day before a match. We dont even know if the make shift team had trained together!! Today, Dyche put out the strongest team he had available and played them in a formation to best utilise each player. This is all he could do. Then a few Watford players missed good chances to take the lead and even had shots saved by a keeper who had a good day. Then came a controversial decision from the referee in giving Southampton a penalty. From then on heads dropped and we conceded another penalty. Then at half time Hogg was replaced by Jenkins due to injury, this is a straight swap, DMF for DMF, nothin unusual there. Then Dyche makes a second substitution bringing on Deeney for Yeates. This was probably tactical to give us some fresh legs and try to spice up the attack. Then comes the third goal, apparently the defence giving Guly too much space and allowing him to slot the ball in the bottom corner. Then Dyche sends on Iwellumo to give Sordell a rest and to give Big Chris a run out. This is nothing unusual as the game was beyond us by this point. Then we let in the fourth, again due to our defence giving the opposition too much time and space on the ball. Why is it then that the manager will get the flack for things over which he has no control. He can not tell the players which decisions to make, which side of the keeper to put the ball or how to take the free-kick. He is unable to influence a game after he sends his team onto the field, he can just wave his arms and gesture at what he wants. However, this rarely happens. I would like to see people back off the managers and recognise that it is rarely their fault but usually the players fault!!
I totally agree that managers often do seem to be the only ones blamed for a poor team performance. Guess its because he selects the team...with regard to the defensive situation I presume Hodson is injured and Tom James deemed not good enough to fill for Dickinson. Would say I have some doubts over how we play (even when we've won) and TBF Dyche has let some good youngsters who could cover injuries/illness but it does worry me that highly paid footballers always need to be motivated to play...maybe that is why we have been poor at times? Not just talking about ours BTW..its a negative aimed at England managers as well. Players aren't really that fussed...as Sordell appears to be in recent games sadly. Trouble is you cannot sack a player..but a manager can be changed ASAP. I doubt we'd get anyone that good and TBH didn't expect a quality name when Mackay went.
I'm not so sure it's the managers fault. More a total lack of quality in the squad. Today was more evidence that quantity does not equal quality.
And that "quantity" was bought in by? ----------------------------------------------- A manager with the smallest budget in the league trying to get the best players he could. If those were the best players he could get why should he be criticised for signing them? Would you rather he signed no players at all?
I was not criticising SD, I was trying to point out the inconsistency in Bloother's argument. He cannot argue it is not the manager's fault because there isn't the quality in the squad. Personally I think that time will show that at least 2 players will be a waste of money, 2 will be OK and 2 will be great signings - but then that's the average for most managers.....We simply can't tell yet which 2 will fall into which category.
Sorry Vic, read Chriswfc's response. Not inconsistent at all. You're not having a good weekend are you?
Jurys still out on SD in my book , rather than bringing so many , it may have been better to bring in less quantity and and slightly better quality! I still think some of the players bought in arent any better then some of the kids that were breaking into the team last season! easy to say with hindsight!!!
I'm with you Norway, but when most of these players were signed they looked like good signings. However, from what I have seen this season (which is all but two games) there is a lack of quality at the moment, and the assertion that this squad is better than last season's squad is looking a bit dubious.
On the subject of how much praise and criticism a manager deserves, I read Aidy Boothroyds interview on the Watford Legends website and it reminded me of how important his influence was in that promotion season. He had a very clear vision of how he wanted to play and invested money from player sales to build a team to succeed at this level. He created a huge amount of self belief in the players and changed the way the team was set up many times to exploit any sort of weakness that he and his team may have detected in the opposition. Boothroyd deserved praise for that success, in the way he created a winning culture, recruited the right players to execute his plans and changed things during the season and critically during games to affect the result. Reading that article in the context of assessing Dyche's first 3 months in charge is an interesting exercise.
The issue with Sean Dyche at the moment is the lack of imagination and creativity as well as the fact that his team selection does not match the tactics. Lets face it, we are going to stay up by playing long balls up to the front two and playing off of them, its just how it works at this level when players arent technically gifted on the ball. Apart from Marv and Hogg none of our players have the ability to control the ball and pass it well. Now basing survival on this tactic isnt the worst thing in the world, Sam Allardyce is a master at it and i know its boring and unattractive but to me survival as a club is much more important for the next two seasons. Dyche seems to be half siding towards this plan while still trying to play football sometimes, it has to be one or the other. We can't expect to create anything from long balls unless Iwelumo is on the pitch, its ridiculous to think that Garner can play as a targetman and although Sordell is good at holding up the ball he doesnt have the presence to assert himself for an entire 90 mins. In Iwelumo we have an outlet to lump the ball up to. Another issue with the management of Dyche is his guidance to the players. Unfortunately BHD the managers do have a massive influence on what decision a player makes when he is on the pitch. For instance if Yeates runs at a player rather than crossing and loses the ball time and time again the manager has to tell him what to do instead. This is consistently not happening in the team. Forsyth looks pretty terrible however when he actually attacks and moves with the ball he poses a bigger threat, yet he clearly isnt told to do this as it happens very very rarely. Dyche has to understand that telling players who are incapable of passing the ball quickly and breaking down a team in order to score goals, to play a passing game with some long balls mixed in will just confuse them. Yesterday the ball was frequently played around the back 4 for a while and then just lumped up... it wastes time and has no effect or purpose. Im not calling for Sean Dyche's head yet but he is in a tough situation from which he has to learn quickly and adapt otherwise he will be sacked as gambling on relegation is too big a risk for any club nevermind one with serious financial difficulties. Also the loaning out of Wichelow makes no sense as we do not have another dynamic attacking midfielder in the team. We have to start taking ourselves a lot more seriously and playing the 'Stoke' way with aggression, hunger and a purpose and funnily enough alot of that stems from the manager with Pulis being a perfect example.
A lot of very good points there to which I find myself agreeing with! The manager has control of tactics,ie who plays where and how! we did move the ball nicely in the first 10 mins or so just to hoof it up and give the ball away! this happened a fair few times, to be fair the players didnt look as if they knew what they were doing ,so to a degree it is up to the gaffer!
n8ive, I think that Burkinshaw had more to do with our success under Aidy than he's been ever given credit for - look how we went after KB left and how Aidy did at Colchester and Coventry without an experienced No.2. I think that's what SD really needed, a No.2 that has a lot of managerial experience. Unfortunately there are very few of these and they probably wouldn't come for what we'd offer them.
I understand your point Y_O. Thats my point exactly, a manager cannot change things. He can tell the player to do something, but it is not guaranteed that the player will do it. Dyche will tell the players that he wants them to do, but ultimately the decision lies with them. If they think the best pass is a long one then they do that, if they think the best chance lies in running at a player he will do it. The manager can not make a decision for a player. We loose matches because we are constantly making the wrong decision, we have played some good football this year. It seems we are trying to run the ball into the net rather than shoot it in. I would like to see more people taking a shot from 10-15yards out. If Dickinson can do it then why cant Yeates, Forsythe, Marv and Garner??
On the contrary, I'm having a great weekend. I could post some bland & trite nonsense and have it ignored, so wasting my time. Or I could post something so obviously incorrect and contentious and have a chuckle to myself at all the jumping up and down that ensues on the boards. My word, there's a lot of people take things so seriously. It's only football after all - not life and death.........
Downhearted? Never. Been around long enough not to get too upset when we lose. I've seen us lose at Darlington & go bottom of the old Fourth Division. I've seen us getting soundly beaten at places like Northwich, Southport, Stockport, Cambridge Utd., Mansfield, Wrexham, Crewe, Aldershot etc. etc. etc. So what's a loss to the upwardly mobile Saints in the second best League in England and one of the hardest in Europe with us having the calibre of players that in bygone days would have been far out of reach? And I do sympathise with Sean Dyche as to the resources he has to bring in players. He is doing better than I thought he would so far. Reminds me of the extremely tight budget Ken Furphy had to make do with to keep us in the Old Div. 2 in the early 70s. He had to make do with an annual transfer budget that was less than a current Watford player's monthly wage! No, we have punched above our weight for over 30 years and some older fans need to remember this and younger fans need to learn some perspective. We have the same size town as places like Slough, Harlow, Chelmsford even Hemel - look where their clubs operate......
