Staines, I think you are a really good poster but you are still trying to goad me with that penultimate sentence. Is it the rule on here that you are only able to post if you nail your mast to one side of the political fence and stoutly defend everything they do?
I will absolutely swear on everything that I hold dear that it was a genuine and honest question......if you look back you will see that there was another poster (Sooper I think) that came up with something good that I hadn’t thought of...I agreed with him...it enlightened me. I asked you the same but you ignored the question. I only have problems with one poster on here, and yes I’ll admit I can goad and lose my rag with that individual (much to my shame).
Why don't you just answer the question? It was asked with no malice or political agenda, just genuine interest from what I've seen. You lads don't half like playing the victim. The only positive I thought I had was that Matt Hancock seemed less of a dick than the others but that has proven not to be the case.
The speed that they set up the Hospital is a BIG plus for the government imho......oh and also the speed that they set up the ‘furlough’ scheme..another BIG plus (think that was Soops one).....with that it’s a shame large companies have abused it but can’t fault the government for that.
I guess you feel the need to defend Boris and that is commendable. I daresay this shambles would have been equally badly handled under a Labour leadership. It has to become a political football, everything does these days. I breathed a sigh of relief when Brexit was running out of steam and now this. I dont wish to antagonize you or Ellers any more than it seems I already have but criticism of the handling of this tragedy doesnt necessarily mean someone has a political agenda. As I have explained in other posts I am probably far too emotional about this subject so if I come across as too aggressive I will apologize. I think the media are also at fault in their reporting and to a certain extent the British public in their willingness to adhere to necessary changes for a short period. Does not apply to all of course but certainly it seems to apply to many.
This is what I mean. 'You lads' suggests two sides. i.e you are either pro the governments handling of this virus or you are against it. That does not need to be the case, there is loads of grey area in between. Why would you assume that because I said that Boris could have died that I am a Boris lover? That is ridiculous. If you look at the stats of how many that go into ICU die you will see that was a possibility. He was clearly genuinely ill. For people to suggest it was put on or exaggerrated is poor I think. I don't see why I can't point that out without being labelled. There is too much of that on here.
Another genuine question for no political point scoring whatsoever (I feel I have to say that).......could the government have done anything better in setting up the ‘furlough’ scheme, and made so companies couldn’t take the piss ? It seems some, like my old company and Virgin were gonna make staff redundant anyway and have just used the scheme as a way of getting the taxpayer to pay wages until the wheels are in motion. Wasn’t the scheme set up to stop,redundancies in the first place ? Were the governments hands tied and it was an ‘all or nobody’ situation ?
Some companies have definately used this to their own advantage. A good friend has just been told he will be redundant as soon as the furlough scheme is finished - not sure on the size of his company but they deal in industrial waste management and have depots all over the north so must be a decent size. I thought furlough was supposed to ensure that these companies survived and people had jobs to go back to once it is deemed safe to return to work?
Exactly mate, that’s my point. The way BA have used the scheme is appalling as anyone in the industry knew that redundancies were always going to happen and it was just the excuse they needed to restructure and cut the wage bill. It just seems we’ve all been taken for fools by these businesses.
Unfortunately people will abuse this system (the same people who generally abuse stuff e.g.Companies that pay staff cash to avoid tax etc) I notices when we did our first claim that it allowed you to go back to the 1st March for instance. Now we furloughed staff from the 26th as that was when we closed but it was easily possible to put in the 1st and claim the whole month. We wouldn't dream of it as it is not how it is intended. That was for the hospitality sectors who had already been affected. Several people that were going to make people redundant anyway will abuse it as you have mentioned but it is very difficult to police and I would imagine it is going to be very hard to audit. I have a detailed spreadsheet listing all of our employees furloughed and amounts calculated individually and it can be cross checked against the claim but will everyone have done that? It didn't ask for totals per employee just a list of employees being furloughed and the total claim. The fact that it was up and running and we received the claim a few days later I found quite impressive (especially how long it normally takes to deal with any Inland Revenue queries) but it is definitely open to abuse if people choose to. It would have been near on impossible to come up with a quick system that wasn't though to be fair.
I'm hearing on my (other ) grapevine...and so it may not be true...that the furlough scheme is going to be cut on sunday down to 60% If they still keep in lockdown in place that is a guarantee that it will quickly crumble (mind you it is already crumbling) badly here) as many firms and employees will not take that, and people will go back to work. Booris said at PMQT that he would take some measures on Sunday that will come in to place immediately/the next day. I wonder what those could be
I think if this happens and the threshold is cut to 60 % of wages (I’ve heard the same) then it’s not gonna effect the companies involved but the workers themselves.....these companies should be ashamed of themselves and made by law to top up the wages of workers to at least the 80 % mark (and in my opinion the up to 100%). It should be remembered that a furloughed worker is, I think, only getting 80% of their bad IV wage..,.it doesn’t include extras they may rely on like unsocial hours or overtime payments. Some people really do rely on this to get by. All this puts the government in a very difficult situation that is not of their doing.
Do you really believe that Beth? That it’s human nature to cheat others? I don’t, I just think some people are ****s who require a bit of re-education. I think calling it ‘human nature’ is just a get out of jail free card to people who cheat and a bit of an insult to those who don’t. If we don’t hold ourselves accountable for our own actions we might as well empty the prisons and blame God or the tooth fairy for all the bad behaviour, because it’s ‘just human nature’. Oops, bit OTT. Just a phrase that pisses me off. Sorry.
Well hold on there young man.....every pub, restaurant, shop or other business that is closed down with staff on furlough is closed down because the government told them to shut, so it is a situation of the government’s doing - it might have been the right decision but it was their decision and others were available - Sweden and it seems Germany from what I have been reading have kept many more businesses working. Admittedly some businesses like airlines, will have been impacted by other governments as well. I have a responsibility/accountability buzz going today. It may well become irritating, perhaps I should be ignored.
