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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I see Islamophobia as racism. Boris's article was not racist.

    Was it irresponsible in the way it was phrased? Possibly, but a hell of a lot of people agree with him about the face mask. In liberal France, it's banned! Is that racist?
     
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  2. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    Still defending his outrageous comments. Wow.

    Islam is a religion, not a race Goldy. Sounds like you agree with him yet you call foul whenever anybody is remotely anti-semitic. Double standards Goldy.
     
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  3. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    I agree with him about the veil, headscarf the lot. This was demonstrated ever so well by a woman at our work, not sure why it came up but she was ranting on to someone about wearing the headscarf because that's what she wanted to do, I then said 'yeah that's great, however how would it be accepted within your family and community if you decided you didn't want to wear it?' ... she went silent

    There was two major differences to me, firstly I asked a question diplomatically, the question was said in a way in which it couldn't be seen as antagonistic or childish like 'letterboxes'. Most importantly though I'm not a public figure broadcasting to a potential audience of millions, some of who would have felt empowered to react against, whilst others would have found it to be an attack on something they held dear, Johnson was not entering into a two way conversation.

    I'd agree 100% there needs to be changes in certain religious traditions and practices that promote oppression, however I do understand any changes need to be made with baby steps over time, big demands will only be met with a feeling of victimisation and a backlash will definitely follow
     
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  4. QPR Oslo

    QPR Oslo Well-Known Member

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    Virtually! I'm sure a few will have slipped through. I'd love to see Dominic Grieve back in Parliament.
     
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  5. bobmid

    bobmid Well-Known Member

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    Or taking his verbal gaffs (many of them, homophobic, sexist, racist) and balance that to something Jeremy corbyn has never said. Which is worse?
     
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  6. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    If a politician says niqabs are ridiculous because they cover the face, is that racist? No.

    If a politician says Jewish skull caps are ridiculous because they harm hair growth? No

    See, Fing, they are just talking about an article of clothing that would apply to whoever wore it.
     
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  7. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Look at the exodus of Jewish MP's and members and most probably voters from Corbyn's Labour, and ask yourself that
     
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  8. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Yeah yeah yeah
    But apart from those
    What wrongs has Boris ever done
     
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  9. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    Can you imagine the backlash if Corbyn had made that comment about skull caps? Sometimes things are not best aired, certainly when he used what he must have known would be seen as a derogatory and childish term. As I mentioned previously he is a politician, represents the conservative party and now represents the entire nation, at any point during his career he must see these are things, as a diplomat especially, were flat out wrong
     
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  10. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    <laugh><laugh><laugh>

    Don't tempt me, I could easily do a much longer list
     
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  11. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I'm broadly in agreement there, Will. Personally, I don't have a problem with the headscarf on a consenting adults head but I have an instinctive distrust of anyone that I have to deal with who covers their face.

    Did Boris go over the top? - yes. Has it set the conversation going? - yes. Has it caused problems for some female in the Muslim community? - yes, probably, which is why Boris could have been more sensitive about the words he used - but I agree with his sentiment. As do a lot more.
     
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  12. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    Now you are just being ridiculous Goldy.

    How many times have I said that to be anti-islam is not racist. Don't confuse the two issues Goldy. You are more intelligent than that.

    "They" just talking about an article of clothing - this is the Prime Minister of your country. He should be more responsible than that. His remarks resulted in a spike of 375% in attacks on muslim women in the week immediately after his comments compared to the week previously. He is not a bloke down the pub expressing an opinion to a buddy. What he has to say affects people directly and the least he should do is retract the comments and apologise.

    Thanks for mentioning the skull caps but your comparison is not relevant. I don't see anybody politician or otherwise criticising anybody for wearing a skull cap.

    Some people are offended by men wearing skirts. Why don't we criticise Scotsmen for wearing kilts?
     
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  13. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I think Boris was right to speak out about the niqab. As I say, France has gone a lot further and banned it. Such medieval garb has no place in our society imo

    If Corbyn didn't have the reputation he did on anti-semitism, of course he could have raised an issue of the skullcap, if there was good reason.
     
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  14. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    Not just the women, the entire Muslim community. The platform he used and the way it was raised was always going to cause more harm than it would do good, he must have known that. If anything the conversation was drawn back due to people not wanting to be associated with Johnson's childish and demeaning comments. Rather than writing it in the media, the discussion is better had with people in the community, listening to their views, if I a simple plebeian can see that, someone in Johnson's positions throughout the years surely can.
     
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  15. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    The point I am making, whether you call it Islamaphobic or racist, is that it is perfectly acceptable to comment on a piece of clothing if there is good reason to do so.

    Boris had good reason to comment on the face masks imo.

    Yes, he did it clumsily, and that is where he might be criticised, but not for raising the issue. And for me, clumsy language is not Islamophobic
     
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  16. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    The reputation Corbyn has is pretty much constructed by the media though you must admit. Has there been problems in the Labour party, yes, has he dealt with it effectively, no, I'd agree, the same could be said about the conservatives with Islamaphobia... but only one gets the press.

    For me one of Corbyn's biggest faults is not sticking up for himself enough, especially with all the crap about him being a terrorist supporter/sympathiser. That is widely accepted and repeated by large numbers, yet the truth is totally different, and if it wasn't for Corbyn dealing with some proper horrible ****s many more would almost certainly have died.
     
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  17. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I don't hear you criticising France, an EU country, for banning it. Is what Boris did worse or better?
     
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  18. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    If Corbyn's reputation is constructed by the media, why the Jewish exodus from his party? You're misleading yourself, Will. It's a lot more serious than that
     
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  19. finglasqpr

    finglasqpr Well-Known Member

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    You seem to have a problem with muslims Goldy.

    Criticising them, their culture or their clothing seems to be ok with you but criticising Jewish people seems to be unacceptable. Remember what I said a few weeks ago about people on here having a subtle anti-islam agenda? Bingo. You have just proved it, thanks a lot.
     
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  20. Willhoops

    Willhoops Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion the actions the French took was unwise and a little shocked that more problems haven't arisen than they have, well that I've heard about. I've only been in France briefly over the last few years and not in a position to give a better informed opinion. Maybe it would work over here? However I think the best way of moving this forward is discussions with the communities rather than childish media comments. I'd probably say Johnson's comments were potentially less damaging than the actions the French took though
     
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