Off Topic The Boris Johnson Appreciation Thread

1. The EU is by far our biggest trading partner for starters. At the moment we have access to those markets. Exit under a no deal, and we have to negotiate individual trade deal with countries both inside and outside, and pay tariffs on goods entering the UK from the EU.
2. At the moment our children can take part in the Erasmus funded education program at different universities around Europe. This is good for the sharing of ideas as well as enhancing their experiences.
3. The EU pumps money into the more deprived áreas of the UK as well as other parts of the community. Just ask the people on Merseyside how good it has been for them.
4. Free movement of good, services, money and people across all member states. Why restrict it?
5. If you go to an EU state on holiday, there is access to medical aid if needed. Leave the EU and if a Brit falls ill, the payment will be considerably more.
6. If we stay the value of sterling will stabilise, leave with no deal and it will fall.
7. Loss of Jobs from the UK to the EU and elsewhere
8. Improvements to the environment ranging from our beaches to the quality of our air.
9. The implementation of food standards which could well be eroded if the US wants to get a trade agreement post Brexit.
10. The protection of workers such as the máximum working hours one should work.

If the UK leaves, it has to leave with a deal, and there is no indication that Johnson will get one. May had one but he and his oiks blocked it so he is guilty of stopping Brexit that 17.4 million voted for. It needs to protect the GFA, it needs to protect Jobs and the economy. May´s deal was fair in recognising the needs of everyone, but Johnson and his mob, chose to vote against it so that he could gain power, not in the interests of the country but himself.

Now let´s have your 10 wonderful reasons for leaving

1. Mogg and Johnson running the country.
2. Trade deal with Trump.

 

But not one covering the democratic vote to leave being ignored.

 

1. The EU is by far our biggest trading partner for starters. At the moment we have access to those markets. Exit under a no deal, and we have to negotiate individual trade deal with countries both inside and outside, and pay tariffs on goods entering the UK from the EU. - Could we not join the European Free Trade Alliance or negotiate better deals with the other 180+ countries on the other five continents?
2. At the moment our children can take part in the Erasmus funded education program at different universities around Europe. This is good for the sharing of ideas as well as enhancing their experiences. - So none of them go to other countries outside the EU currently and would absolutely not be able to do similarly after leaving?
3. The EU pumps money into the more deprived áreas of the UK as well as other parts of the community. Just ask the people on Merseyside how good it has been for them. Are you certain we will not be able to? Please provide evidence to this effect.
4. Free movement of good, services, money and people across all member states. Why restrict it? - If the EU are willing to negotiate a good deal there will be no need to, just more conditioned and regulated so people don't abuse the system.
5. If you go to an EU state on holiday, there is access to medical aid if needed. Leave the EU and if a Brit falls ill, the payment will be considerably more. Get a visa and travel insurance you cheap bastard!
6. If we stay the value of sterling will stabilise, leave with no deal and it will fall. Is that guaranteed? It is possible and probably likely but it'll bounce back, as I've mentioned a lot of EU members currencies and economies are struggling themselves.
7. Loss of Jobs from the UK to the EU and elsewhere - not if they are willing to negotiate a fair and reasonable deal which they aren't.
8. Improvements to the environment ranging from our beaches to the quality of our air. The EU have these rules yes but are you implying we will just **** the country ourselves if we come out and will have no environmental policies because we are out of the EU?
9. The implementation of food standards which could well be eroded if the US wants to get a trade agreement post Brexit. Probably my biggest worry until I realised I could just buy un-chlorinated/free-range/organic products using my own brain.
10. The protection of workers such as the máximum working hours one should work. Again you seem to be under the impression we can't figure out these things with out the EU holding our hand along the way - we aren't exactly going to revert to slave labor and sweat shops are we?

If the UK leaves, it has to leave with a deal it has to be a GOOD deal, and there is no indication that the EU are willing to negotiate one. May had a **** one but luckily all MP's from both sides rejected this and are aiming for the Brexit that 17.4 million voted for. May´s deal was bending over and letting the EU insert a giant purple dildo up us, but Johnson and the rest of the MP's (432 MPs voted against the Brexit deal, while 202 voted to support it - mainly Tories I'd imagine) chose to vote against it so that we were not their little bitches going forwards.

 

Actually, I'm very pissed off that the ERG are ignoring the referendum of 40 years ago that overwhelmingly voted to join
Nobody voted to leave without a deal. This is the want of the ERG in order to not pay tax on their unearnt 'investment' income. I will just mention two of hundreds of things that no deal means to us.
1. Retirement state pensions will be at 75!
2. National health disappears - you get sick, you pay.
Oh, and we join 2 other countries, one of which is North Vietnam to have the kind of WTO arrangements we will have.
And.... Why such resistance to a second vote on the 'will of the people'? Perhaps because the 'protest voters' have realised the seriousness of it all
I hope you don't have a big mortgage, you will be royally screwed when interest rates increase and wages reduce.

 

I know the bolded part is tongue in cheek but you're actually wrong.

We never voted on whether we should join the EU. We voted on whether to join the Common Market which is hugely different to what the EU is. We joined the EU without even being asked. The politicians decided and simply went ahead.

Also it's a Remainer fiction about nobody voted to leave without a deal. We voted to leave. Full stop, end of. There was no caveats or provisos about deal or no deal in the vote. Therefore that aspect is irrelevant. We voted to leave.

Resistance to a second vote is purely down to not having actioned the first vote. Again there was no "skinchies" or best of three on the first vote. We had a democratic vote which everyone had a chance to have their say and decided to leave. When was the last General Election we had which we didn't allow the "winning" party to take power before insisting on a second General Election because a lot of people didn't like or agree with the first General Election result? Action the first vote and we can then happily have a second vote. If the Remainers lose a second vote would they want a third and a fourth etc until "the People" got it right?

 

Purple dildo you say?

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I'm sorry but the whole leave campaign was about how easy it would be to get a good deal.
Personally, I don't know about you, but I have a brain the size of a planet and still had to go through quite a learning process to understand the massive social and economic consequences of leaving.
However, we could be gone already had the ERG not voted against the deal. There is consistent overwhelming evidence that people have changed their minds, despite being denied relevant information (see contempt of parliament).
Personally, I believe the advisory referendum should never have happened, most of us did not know what we were voting for. However, despite the Tories not reaching across the aisle to get consensus on leaving (Corbin wanted to Leave), it all could have happened but for the agenda of our inherited wealth, Etonian, masters.
Our economic and social problems are not the fault of Europe, but of successive governments, Left(ish) and right, and their abject failure to address the needs of rapidly dimishing economic power in a rapidly changing world.
Leave without a deal and, in the words of the much esteemed Mr. Chip Shop - we're ****ed.
And finally, quote from the Twat Farage when he thought they had lost. "The fight goes on"

 

Can we please put to bed this nonsense about people not voting to leave without a deal. We were never asked that question. People didn't vote to leave without a deal, people didn't vote to leave with a deal. People voted to leave full stop. That is the question we were asked, do we still want to be part of the EU. There was a clear indication from the British public that they no longer wanted to be part of the EU. Everyone who voted knew full well there was a negotiation to be done after the vote on the terms of our exit - this was to be handled by our elected representatives.

It’s a bit of a Remoaner Red Herring this because when you vote in a general election you don’t really know what policy is going to come three years down the line. Their manifestos rarely match up to reality but that isn't just because they are a bunch of charlatans. This is a changing landscape they are working in so we accept it. As such you vote on a principle, and the same logic applies to Brexit. We voted to leave and left it in the hands of our politicians to deliver it, end of story. No amount of remoaner fiction is going to change that.

I can't believe this nonsense has been allowed to be regurgitated for so long. I voted remain and would still do so if asked again. However I am sick of hearing this utter bollocks I have to say. As a remainer I was well aware of the risks. I simply thought given we were already aligned, the deal should be fairly easy to do if both sides approach it positively - so yes I didn't want to leave but I could see a way forward if we did. The EU's behaviour has certainly not been helpful, and nor has that of our own MPs, many of whom have put their own self interest above the public's wishes.

The vote was only advisory of course. However I think we all accepted that once asked, that vote needed to be enacted. Otherwise why the **** ask!

 

We means something like 33% of voters, many of whom would not vote that way again. We are a parliamentary democracy, our politicians make decisions, not the odd referendum. There is absolutely no will of the people to leave without a deal (or even to leave at all) Neither is there anything like a majority of MP's to leave without a deal.
If I buy a house without seeing it (as in from plan), there is no legal way I am committed to that if the actual house is not what I was told it would be. And don't get me started on the propaganda tool that is our largely foreign owned media.
Democracy only works when people are given honest information. We weren't and this is the biggest political challenge to this country since World War 2.

 

I think I did answer your question about adherring to the democratic vote. To leave with a deal. We had a deal. But Johnson et al voted it down. So he is to blame for things go pear-shaped and belly-up.

And I think your fathers, grandfathers and previous generations in the North East would be horrified to think that people in that part of the world and endorsing a policy devised by the most extreme and right-wing Tories imaginable. No Geordie with any pride would do such a thing.

 

either way the north east takes the brunt of it

 

I'm ignoring the 33% comment. We had a vote and the result was clear. The make up of that is not important, the result is crystal clear. Care to back up the bold bit with facts or this just another throw away line we keep hearing from those trying to prevent us doing what the people voted to do?

This advisory thing is another red herring too in my opinion. There is one big problem with it that no one can lie about or get away from. Our politicians, campaign leaders from both sides, everyone involved with the whole affair agreed that they would honour the vote whichever way it fell. Unfortunately all this advisory stuff is just people rowing back on their promises.

Another red herring for me personally which needs put to bed is that this notion that it was the lies told by the remain campaign that made the difference. There is zero evidence of that. Its just conjecture from those rowing back on the vote. Most I know who voted leave did so long before any campaign or a ****ing NHS bus - they knew the moment the government announced there would be a vote. Its either serious head burying or desperately clutching at straws. Either way its irrelevant to me.

 

Pretty much every poll for the past 2 years say so, which as you would probably have pointed out, is not the same as an actual vote. If you believe you still are the will of the people, why oppose a vote on what has become 3 options, not the binary vote in the first place? and pretty much all of us remainers would accept its result, without threatening civil unrest and violence.
But this is all a distraction from the key point. I'm still waiting for actual reasons why leavers want to leave. Ironically, the elephant in the room one, will result in many many more immigrants from places like India.
Simple question, what are we going to export, under what trade agreements that we don't already?
Follow up - Vast proportion (about 80% I believe but would need to check) of our exports of goods is to the EU, completely tarrif and border friction free. The EU, and hence we, have trade agreements with just about the whole world, post leave, deal or not. We have a couple with a couple of tiny islands in the middle of the Atlantic . And then there is the trillion dollar deal with the criminal America First president, but only if we get involved in keeping his 'Executive' privilege protection and we send our boys and girls to take part in his wars around the world.
Huawei the lads.

 

Please refer to our "Are you a Geordie" thread and my previous comments regarding my platinum and diamond spoons

You keep referring to the deal being turned down by "Boris and his cronies" but there were 600+ votes and 2/3rds rejected it so over half of the MP's rejected it and as you have pointed out not even half of MP's are Tories so I'm not sure your math is adding up.

As WP correctly keeps saying I'm a bit bored of the people who didn't vote the same way as me, telling me I didn't know what I voted for. The other thing I don't think remoaners take in to account is, and I highly doubt, if we had voted to remain there would be any of this crying and name calling that there is from the remain side from the leavers had it not gone our way. Yes there are a few more intangibles on this side of the result but I do think it is worth reamainers considering what the shoe would have been like on the other foot.

 

We shouldn't ignore the referendum.result. We should recognise it for what it was; an opinion on a general concept carried out at a point when (necessarilly) everyone had far less information than is available now.

 

My last post on this thread as I'm busy looking for a cheap little European retirement home.
The last bit of your post has a simple answer. A continuation and perhaps escalation of the 40 year anti Europe tropes of much of our media (hello straight banana). Farage all over the media campaigning for a second vote instead of actually going into the Hague to do the job he is paid for, particularly attending fisheries debates which he rarely has, despite presenting himself as the saviour of the British fishing industry. Old, never has beens, like Bill Cash et al proposing new legislation to get out in Parliament. Oh. And old men and women charging down the streets with their Zimmer frames, holding rolled up copies of the Daily Mail as weapons.
Other than that, I think leavers would have accepted defeat graciously.

 

there’s lots of misdirection by remoaners and remainiacs. Filtering out all the wild ‘facts’ thrown around it all boils down to people and what they want. They’ve had their say but it’s been ignored so far.

the general election will be the first opportunity they have to have another say and I predict carnage for Labour. I can see them being the third biggest party and even them having to splinter into two.

A lot of Mp’s are running scared because they know exactly what is coming their way in a month or two... the dole queue.

It will be a popcorn moment.

 

A continuation and perhaps escalation of the 40 year anti Europe tropes - So this isn't just a knee jerk reaction - people have been feeling this way for decades but I'm sure a lot of remainers have said that the 6 months of campaigning before the vote was the reason and they lied throughout all of it? Have they been lying for 40 years?

Bill Cash I had to look up but his Wiki page makes he seem like a decent lad that just doesn't like the EU - Cash is chairman of a number of All-Party African committees, including those on Kenya and Uganda. He is also chairman of the All-Party Committee on Malaysia. He has also served as chairman on the All-Party Group for the Jubilee 2000 (1997–2000).[11] He is chairman of the All-Party Sanitation and Water Committee (Third World) in which he works closely with Wateraid and Tearfund.[12] He introduced the Gender Equality (International Development) Bill, 2013,[13] which, although only 18th in the Private Members Ballot, was enacted in March 2014. Mariella Frostrup wrote in The Times, "The new law that puts gender equality at the heart of our overseas aid policy will be as historic as the Slave Trade Act."[14] Justine Greening, Secretary of State for International Development, wrote in The Telegraph blog "Yet for assiduously steering his Gender Equality in International Development Bill through Parliament over recent months, Bill Cash deserves the recognition of women everywhere. … It's also a proud legacy for a Parliamentary champion of women's rights [..] Bill Cash."[15] The day after the Act came into force, the Prime Minister, David Cameron, told Cash in the House of Commons, "I am sure the whole House will want to join me in commending my hon. Friend on his Bill, and on his legislative achievement to get that important measure on the statute book.

And old men and women charging down the streets with their Zimmer frames, holding rolled up copies of the Daily Mail as weapons. - Not seen that personally but I'm sure there are a few crazy racists grannies and grandpas out there (there probably one in each family to be fair), but what I have seen is NHS nurses screaming Nazi at someone and another remainer assaulting politicians by throwing milkshakes at them - to be fair, good effort to that guy, I thoroughly enjoyed that as I despise both sides left and right equally.

 

They really don't. It really does depend on the poll, depend on when look etc etc. Its still as tight as it was just before the vote. And as you correctly point out its silly to hang your hat on polls. The leave campaign arrogantly did that with the initial vote and found out they were in a minority. It also nicely highlights that the NHS etc isn't what drove people to leave. They now know the details of where we are at, and despite all the uncertainty, knowing that people on both sides said things they couldn't really back up, half this country still wants to go.

 

You have to love the remoan angle. They have a reason for why people voted to leave, none of it involves making the decision for themselves. Its either NHS buses, or 40 years of media deceit. Of course all who voted remain did so on reasoned principles and knew exactly why they voted remain.

I have to say I think a lot of remainers have shown that they have never really got out the pram and still throw their toys out when it doesn't go their way. This is simply hidden behind "sticking to their principles", "I know something is wrong I will stand up to it" "I'll fight for my rights" etc etc. Project fear and the pitfalls of leaving will see us all returned to the stone ages.