Off Topic The Politics Thread

I read an article on the Beeb the other day where some Kraut claimed that the EU was Germany’s ‘destiny’.

Read into that what you will, but every time I see Chancellor Merkel she looks more and more like the results of some hideous experiment conducted by Dr Strangelove, Blofeld and Dr Evil. No wonder she shakes.

 

Great post, Sooper. Sums it up totally. I believe moderate Remainers are beginning to see this.

 

Your 'honeymoon period' is based on turning the UK into a bargain basement economy which is simply trying to make itself attractive to foreign predatory capital - all of those 'nasty' EU laws regarding worker's rights and environmental protection can then be discarded. The UK. can become an off shore tax haven - comparative with the role of Singapore in Asia. Brexit really is becoming one of the biggest corporate Coup d'etats in history if that is your thinking. Does 'sucking up to the Yanks, Japs and Chinese' have anything to do with this 'sovereignty' which is broadcast by the Brexiteers as one of the main reasons for Brexit ? Does opening up your legs for the rest of the World to jump in really sound like sovereignty ?

 

If I were to use detremental words about Jews, Asians, Pakistanis, or blacks on here there would be an outcry - so why is it ok. about Germans ?

 

Well said that man

 

I quite like Mutti Merkel and obviously hope she's not suffering from anything serious. I'm also an admirer in many respects of post - WW2 Germany. But there's no doubt German elite have always seen one United States of Europe run from Berlin (with a rubber stamp office in Brussels) as their destiny. It's in their DNA, they can't help themselves. And most of Europe doesn't have the economic power to resist.

The Common Market was a great idea - it's all gone south since then.

 

Oh, yuk! (last sentence)

 

The alternative appears to be bending over and taking it up the arse from Merkel, Macron et al...

 

He used to write for Mills and Boon
He has a point though - we could be in a position where we have no choice but to accept deals with US, China etc that are very one sided. Just have to wait and see I guess.

 

Typical left wing interpretation of perfectly reasonable language. You chaps always have to take our comments to the extreme and then get all waspish and spittle-flecked over what you’d like us to have said rather than what we actually said.

 

I knew someone would get hot under the collar over the use of the word Kraut. I won’t get upset if they call us Tommies; how about that? I couldn’t care less that some Frogs call us Rosbifs. It’s all ****.

 

There is nothing unequivocal about 'sucking up to the Yanks, Japs and Chinese' - these are your words not mine, and have precious little to do with sovereignty.

 

Would of done but forgot to post the article last month x would you like to know the lottery results for next week?

 

They are only words that somehow the masses deem not acceptable. I got called a **** twice yesterday but then again I am one

 

Your little rant took it all over the place, you little minx

 

Me too. With bells on.

 

Now that Boris is (I hope he is) determined to leave in October, with or without deal, I would be utterly amazed if the EU did not move from its intransigent position, so that there is a last-minute deal. There is absolutely nothing in a no-deal for the EU : -

- trade relations with an important customer (UK) are negatively affected

- the fragile Eurozone economy is rocked

- Germany could be pushed into recession or a deeper recession that it will already be in

- no agreement is made on £39bn so it will at the least be delayed and some will never be paid

- Ireland's economy will be affected particularly badly and could take years to recover

So far as the UK is concerned, our economy will suffer too, but we keep £39bn and we get Brexit done, so we can move on.

Clearly, we'll be in a transition stage. The US, China etc may take advantage, but they want deals too, so won't walk away if we stand up for ourselves.

All my money is on a last-minute deal with the EU. This is how they do business. Huge pressure relying on their size, and then negotiate "at the door of the court"

 

I think Cologne's interpretation was on the money. It's why the Brexit fundamentalists actively want to leave without a deal, so that we can be 'free' to scrap whatever pesky workers rights, human rights, environmental protections or food hygiene regulations that they feel would hamper them in the quest to turn the UK into an unregulated tax haven.

 

The big issue there Goldie is time. There's no way they can renegotiate it by 31 October - so if it is going well and he needs another short extension to get it over the line will people accept that? I imagine most of the leave supporters on here probably would but it's a risky strategy for him.

 

Worth following up on this Goldie because I suspect that suspicion of German motives has a lot to do with Brexit. To suggest that European domination is in the German DNA is, presumably, based on what happened in the past - by the same token can I say that the quest for World domination is set in the British DNA because of the history of the empire ? If you use history in this way where do you stop ? Objectively Germany has a proportion of the members of the EU Parliament, based on its population - which could be outvoted by any 2 countries. They are under represented in both the EU Commission, and the EU negotiating team over Brexit. They constitute 22% of the population of the EU, and pay in 25% of the budget (not a great difference). So where do you get the idea that Germany wants to rule Europe - other than by reference to the actions of people who are mostly dead ? I agree that Germany has an export/import imbalance, and that this is not good for the EU (nor is it good for German spending power) - I also agree that Germany is dragging it's feet on Co2 reduction - but I fail to see how Germany is deliberately trying to dominate Europe. There is no sense of 'destiny' in this - the vast majority of Germans are only interested in their own living standards (pretty much the same as everyone else), and are relatively uninterested in what happens elsewhere. There is no 'German DNA' Goldie - we are not talking biology here.