How do you know it was the first? Apparently Toulouse put in a bid too, but Pontus wanted to stay in england. It was then modified to London when no more bids came in. Wasn't he told 3 weeks ago that he was being sold? Surely any interest by other teams would have been declared in the 3 weeks he was available?
You're more than likely right, but surely most clubs would at least try to create a bidding war, still a bit of time left in the window. Pogba wants out of scum but they aint prepared to give him away just to speed things up.
Aye, but they've got pots of cash. We haven't. He was trouble & we wanted rid. There was no bidding war as no-one was interested. Wonder if he'll sack his agent now, as agents of numpties are normally able to start bidding wars for the most unlikely candidates.
Whilst I don't disagree with you, they have sold someone 4 times over his market value because some club was stupid enough to both offer it and pay it, and they would have probably been happy to keep him if that offer hadnt been made. We have sold someone for market value, because an individual within the club wanted that player gone, and after a short time trying to sell him, he went for the best offer we got. Time will tell if the decision was correct or not. However we could just have easily been sat here discussing that fact that Bielsa walked because the club werent prepared to sell Jansson, and that come the end of the season we could easily be fuming because failure to accept an offer for a player cost us promotion. The issue is that rightly or wrongly the club decided to back a well respected manager as opposed to one of our more influential players. On the basis that the club probably tried to work out the differences between the two, but neither party was prepared to compromise, one of those two involved would end up being the sacrificial lamb, that would end up being detrimental to the club in some way. On this occasion the club backed Bielsa, as they did with Saiz. At some stage if it keeps happening, I would expect the club to say sorry Bielsa, but we cant keep selling players cheaply because you have fallen out with them, change your ways or leave Thus the club are more than able to negotiate appropriate transfer fees for players other than when backed into a corner by either a player or management. The Roofe situation could end up similar. Whilst I agree that maybe his wage should be more inline with Bamford's, I also think we are paying Bamford too much, and thus wouldnt expect the club to offer Roofe the same deal, unless management says we must keep Roofe at all cost. Thus if Bielsa thinks we can replace Roofe easily enough, so there is no reason to meet his demands, we are in the situation of either letting him run down his contract ( in which case we end up with either a Beckford situation where he gives the club everything he can in the remaining 12 months or a Charlie Taylor situation where he just waits for his contract to end) or we decide to cash in now, knowing that we will get a fee for him, just not the over inflated fee that we may hope for
I’m bored of saying this now but market value is what someone is prepared to pay. If someone wants to buy something you don’t want to sell they have to tempt you with an inflated offer. If you make it clear you want to sell, they don’t need to do that. Jansson is 28. At the end of his contract he has no resale value. But someone in their early 20’s, is potentially going to increase in value if they fulfil their potential. Ultimately dean smith wanted a lad he knew from Brentford more than he wanted Jansson. No one else wanted Jansson. I agree we could have held on to try and get an auction going... but sounds like the door wasn’t getting beaten down for him.
Okay but what if we don’t go up, Bielsa walks away as he only has one year of his contract? Then, have we sold a good player that the new manager could use?
But the club had to deal with the issue now, Bielsa didnt want Jansson around the club. The club had to back either the manager or the player, in this case they chose the manager. Only time will tell if that decision was right or wrong. What do we do with that good player in the meantime, that the manager doesn't want near the club or training ground. Send him out on loan on the chance that we fail in our promotion bid and that a new manager may use him in 12 months time. What if Bielsa decides to give it another season, so we now have a player that the manager doesnt want, except this time he is one year older with one year less on his contract, and now we can only get someone to pay £2m for him Let him sit at home for 12 months whilst we pay him his weekly wage, so he can watch tv, and spend time with his family. There are plenty of what if situations. Unfortunately the club had to make a decision now, not in 12 months time, and no matter what that decision had been, there would be plenty of fans disagreeing with it. However given Bielsa's standing within the club at present ( I mean with the board, not fans) then it is fairly obvious that they will back Bielsa every time. In the situation of having to sell Jansson now for a reasonable fee, having Jansson sat at home for 12 months with his feet up whilst paying him his wages(during which time his saleable value would be decreasing), or Bielsa deciding to walk now (and I've no idea if that was realistic, but we know he has a history for it), I know what I would go for, on the basis that there is no compromise between the two individuals. So what would you decide to do in that situation ? If everyone on here answered that question, I wouldn't be surprised at the variety of different answers, meaning there would be plenty of posters disagreeing with each other, and thus no matter what the club decided, there was always going to be a high amount of disgruntlement.
so what you are saying WJ is that the club should have backed Jansson, that way Bielsa would leave and thus our new manager would be more than happy to welcome Saiz back into the fold However being serious now and with no knowledge on whether there is any interest in Saiz, I can see us releasing him from his contract, in which case maybe we would have been better selling him for 2 or 3m last January rather than going down the route we did , in an attempt to sell him for 6m (again of course that would have been dependent upon someone offering 2m for him at the time), although of course that would have caused many an outrage on here at the time as well
LOL. No, I just liked the 'What if ...?' question & immediately thought of Saiz. I really have no clue what will happen if he can't find a club. I'm hoping he doesn't come back as requested & we fine him 2 weeks wages - every week!
I agree with everything you’ve said apart from the fee being reasonable. One thing it does emphasise is as brilliant as he is, Bielsa is no man manager.
Enjoyed the discussion LoL, and quite happily accept that we have different interpretations of what is a "reasonable" fee. Although of course my interpretation is the more "reasonable" one
He’s very intense and I don’t think man management on a 1:1 basis is a strength of his. Don’t think this is a case of that though. All previous managers have had issues with Jansson. So the one that kicks him out has man management issues? Maybe it’s the one who recognises that it’s important for the good of the team that his authority can’t be challenged continually. There’s an argument that you need to be pragmatic at times like fergie was with Cantona for example... but jansson’s no Cantona and ultimately bielsa’s philosophy is demanding the same commitment from everyone. You can’t accommodate the Saiz and jansson’s that take the piss.
I have to disagree. I think Bielsa has excellent man-management qualities. Even better, he has a squad view in his man management style. He's made the boundaries clear to every player, and only one player has constantly pushed those boundaries. I don't know how many times Pontus was told 'no', or how many last warnings came his way, but one thing is for sure - Bielsa was decisive, which we should applaud. A lesser manager might have folded, like our previous managers, who allowed the fuse to be lit. I just can't find the words, tbh. You couldn't get a better example of a man-manager.
I was trying to differentiate between men management and man management. I think if you set clear boundaries, are consistent with them and fair and even handed with your measures, then everyone knows where you stand. What I personally don’t think he’s great at (and it’s just a perception based on snippets of info) is in the geeing the team up, or psychological carrot and stick stuff. I just think he’s too much of an ocd geek for the touchy feely side of things
