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Off Topic OLOF's political thread

Discussion in 'Leeds United' started by MIGHTY, Oct 1, 2017.

  1. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    LOL. I agree we were conned. For exactly the same reasons we've been conned into voting either Brexit or Remain. Incorrect data.
     
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  2. blonogasoven

    blonogasoven Well-Known Member

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    May I ask if you had a positive reason for voting to remain or was it a fear of the consequences if we leave?
     
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  3. OLOF

    OLOF Well-Known Member

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    And you agree we're not venturing into the unknown, having been there 46 years ago?
    Maybe the vote to leave was because of the lies in 1973 and 1975, hindsight is a wonderful thing<whistle>
     
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  4. lifecheshirewhite

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    I can but you wont read them you will pretend they aren't there and stick your head in the sand as normal.
    Yes I do know something you don't know but that's not difficult, but I suspect everyone else knows, it's just you so no big secret.
    BBC finds evidence that French helped Argentines sink our ...

    How France helped both sides in the Falklands War - bbc.com

    There you go,the French had a team who were in Argentina and got the Exocet missiles working so they could sink our ships,so the Sheffield,and the Atlantic conveyor,that's 2 ships destroyed thanks to France nearly lost us the war.But they did let us use a port in Africa <doh>
    You are naive in the extream if you believe your Spanish crap post,where do you think Argentina got that Idea they had a secret pact with Spain from ?
    wake up ffs,they had the agreement,they just denied it when it came out due to embarrassement.<doh>

    ow and our EU friends Belgium who would still be Germans if it wasn't for us refused to sell us any weapons.<doh>
     
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  5. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    It would be naive to think things would be the same as 46 years ago. Remember, we called the shots then. Not now.
     
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  6. lifecheshirewhite

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    Hardly called the shots, they forced massive payments on us that took many years to get a rebate on.
    And the frogs vetoed the first 2 attemps to join, so looks like we called no shots.
     
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  7. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    ROFL

    You say I won't read any links you give? Well I read the one & only one you gave. Do you realise the link you posted is exactly the same one I just gave you & quoted the opening paragraph from? I think you only read the one bit that suited your argument & skipped all the other rebutting information. Yes, there is no doubt that there was a French team there working against us. Surely it was far more significant that France worked with MI6 to sabotage the Exocets, for instance?

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uk...helped-us-win-Falklands-war-by-John-Nott.html

    I'm waiting on whatever link you were going to provide re. the Spanish involvement. I can't find anything other than the rebutting official statement I gave you. What evidence do you have to support your notion? For that's all it is - a notion. And unless you supply evidence to prove otherwise, it will always remain another unsupported Chesh conspiracy theory that has only been published in his head.

    What's this EU friends nonsense? Did you actually read what I said about the vote? I think you're assuming I'm a Remainer. I'm nothing of the sort. I've very clearly stated that I have no idea which is best, due to lack of good data. I question both views.
     
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  8. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    I see where you're confused on this one & it may be down to the way I've written the post.

    I was meaning that we called the shots in a global trading sense in those days (i.e we had considerable influence & leverage, much, much more than now. There's no way we'll be able to return to that elevation these days as things have moved on considerably since then.

    The classic consideration is the Commonwealth countries that we burned our boats with to join the EEC. We can't boss those countries like we used to then.

    You also have to consider the power new economies have now, like China & India. Both will require substantial immigration to the UK as part of the trade deals with them, which lies in the face of one of the main tenets of Brexetism. Sadly true.
     
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  9. lifecheshirewhite

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    You put a link up from the news paper, I put 2 up from the BBC, not the same link at all, yours from 2002 says they gave information on how to sabatage Exorcets, mine from 2012 says they repaired Exorcets that weren't working, and were responsible for 3 hits on ships, 2 sunk.
    You won't find a Spain link,because of course they would deny it, their economy depends on British tourists,Hitler said he didn't start WW2 did you believe him as well <doh>
     
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  10. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    Apologies. You're right re. the link. I had both open & was going to post the BBC one myself (and thought I had, tbh). Both and very similarly worded opening paragraphs, hence the confusion on my part. But note that both quoted Sir John Nott, claiming France was our closest ally during that war. So that is concrete evidence of our Government's view, and the comments were made many years later, long after the French team subterfuge was revealed.

    But you claiming that team represented the view of France is pissing in the wind compared to the published word of our then MoD.

    (For the record, if you'd read it correctly, they didn't repair the Exocets - it was 3 launchers. I'm sure that was a genuine mistake on your part. Aye right! <doh> ).

    Spain. Thank you for your admission that you've presented a conspiracy theory as fact & have no evidence whatsoever to prove it other than random thoughts bouncing about in your wee head :D
     
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  11. lifecheshirewhite

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    Does it matter what they fixed, our wonderful French allies, killed lots of British armed forces, with there betrayal, and Spain not my idea, Argentina said so, and given the choice of believing them or Spain, I believe Argentina.82 was the year of the Falklands war, and also the year of the Spain World Cup, I remember the Spanish chanting Argentina in the football grounds, I remember the police beating up innocent Brits up with batons, and as now they wanted Gibraltar back,you haven't mentioned our other EU backstabbers Belgium who refused to sell us any weapons.
    There was a ten year gap between your link and mine, yours was when we thought the French had helped us, mine was when we realised how they had backstabbed and betrayed us.
     
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  12. dbc

    dbc Well-Known Member

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    Happy to list the reasons I voted remain,

    I like the ability to live, travel and work in 27 other countries (and have no issues with others doing the same).

    I like the influence the EU has on the world stage and the influence we have on the EU. We're a big fish in the EU which in turn is a big fish in the world. There's a reason Putin wants Brexit and a weaker EU. We've managed to use the EU very well to our advantage in terms of influence and positioned ourselves well for a country of our size between USA and Europe (both diplomatically and financially).

    The talk of us being the 5th largest economy is true but the difference between the 5th economy and 10th economy is smaller than the gap between 4th and 5th. The EU is the 2nd largest economy in the world bigger than China but smaller than the US and that matters when it comes to trade talks. The bigger the hand you have to bring to the table the better the deal you get.

    Peace has been covered in posts above but it is still a remarkable and I think underrated achievement in a continent that has been ravaged and destroyed by wars for decades.

    I like the regulations and workers rights that have been introduced or cemented under the EU - again with a global economy look at the equivalent conditions in America and China and the EU is a player that can protect those rather than just compete in a race to the bottom.

    I see a lot of issues in the country (austerity, housing, wage stagnation etc etc) but I put the majority of the blame for that at (successive) UK governments not the EU and do not see leaving the EU solving those issues.

    Is the EU perfect, no of course not but I think the real problems will get worse as a result of leaving rather than getting better.
     
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  13. Ringo Lion

    Ringo Lion Pumpkin

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    Leave or Remain was the question Yes or No, nothing about how we were to leave if the vote went that way. The same can be said in relationships, shall we have sex or not/, yes or no, you decide yes we will have sex, you don't debate will it be soft sex or hard sex?, you'll end up losing the moment, you get on with it and do the deed to the best of your ability, if its not good to start with you work at it to make it better in the future, eventually it'll be poetry in motion!!<smooch>:emoticon-0165-muscl<cheers>
     
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  14. brisbane-lion

    brisbane-lion Well-Known Member

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    Hey, Ringo, like a hand? I'm free!!! :emoticon-0115-inlov
     
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  15. Ringo Lion

    Ringo Lion Pumpkin

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    <yikes><yikes> Its ok Brissy, I can manage thank you.
     
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  16. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    But oddly enough, both contained the quote from Nott, which was the whole point of the link - it supported my argument, not yours, and still does. You have offered absolutely nothing other than some French guys that had self-interest at the centre of their activities. It's like saying that because Corbyn attends terrorist funerals that our Government supports this. Nope. Rogue is rogue.

    And a few drunk football supporters chanting defines a country's foreign policy, does it? Is that all you've got for your wild assertion? So when we sing 'Stand up if you Hate Man U', we define government policy? Give your head a shake, Chesh. Just admit you have absolutely nothing to support your Spanish nonsense. <doh>
     
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  17. lifecheshirewhite

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    You're a fooking joke WJ,get someone with a brain to explain it to you, my links say John Nott said this 10 years ago, but we have now found the truth and France technician's helped Argentina to get missiles working which killed British and nearly lost us the war.Do you think sinking our ships was helping us then ? give your head a shake. Now show just 1 way how Spain helped us,and stop ignoring Belgium, just because it shows your wrong again, but everyone who can read the links knows that. <laugh>

    PS and Corbyn isn't part of our government and never has been, get someone to explain who our government is.
     
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  18. Whitejock

    Whitejock Well-Known Member

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    LOL. Some things never change. <doh>

    Chesh loses argument & fires off scattergun comments to hope to disguise it. Again. <doh>

    Still reading what you want to read. <doh> Read quotes from Notts' memoirs on the reasons for his view that France was our strongest ally. His view did not change after the renegade action by some individuals from a French company. Then again, you may have some evidence that he retracted these comments and changed his view. But I think we both know such 'evidence' doesn't exist.

    Not exactly why you've pulled in Spain & now Belgium into a discussion originally about war between EU members - or more precisely the lack of war since they signed up to the EU. I'm also pretty sure you've noticed that Spain was not part of the EEC in 1982, but of course ignored it for the sake of trying to save face - which you've failed to do, of course. Your MO is well known to everyone. <doh>
     
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  19. blonogasoven

    blonogasoven Well-Known Member

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  20. lifecheshirewhite

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    On the contrary he did change his view in my link and said [French Duplicity] the engineers weren't renegade, they worked for the French Arms industry and were left there helping Argentina and weren't ever told to stop helping them or called back to France, GAME SET AND MATCH, BURY YOUR HEAD AGAIN, WHISTLE A TUNE AND PRETEND I HAVEN'T DESTROYED YOU AGAIN. <laugh><laugh><laugh><laugh>
     
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