Well all the voting sorted and very interesting how the NI panned out.. sinn fein just managed to get the last seat .. but think they polled the most votes to start but the transferable votes system means unless they actually get enough to make it on the first hit it can all go ti**s up … NIGEL FINISHED on 29 seats … and more than doubled the counting votes of labour .. trolling around came across 2 interviews with labour mp's they are not happy with the labour front bench attitude and proposals being bandied about a GE and REFERENDUM ….. one has to wonder, and it has happened before will a chunk of labour MP'S desert the ship for the Lib DEMS? NOW THAT WOULD BE A GOOD MOVE!!!!!!!!! next step the 2 elections for the tories and lib dems
You literally deserve what you get. As the working class, just like under Thatcher, you and I are going to be the first ****ed over. I appreciate the sentiment and there's no doubting that Churchill was a great, or even incredible leader, but let's not forget as a person he's not exactly the best role model to be following. Any look into history can tell you that. What I can't understand is these baby boomers (not saying it's yourself, I've no idea how old you are) bringing back stories of the wars and the like to try and make out that Brexit is going to be okay. It has absolutely no relevance whatsoever. It was the co-operation with other countries that won us the war. We didn't win the war alone, the allies won the war. We had 400,000 Muslims fight for us back in WW1. What argument are people making when they bring this out? All you have to do is look at our behaviour regarding Ireland throughout history to show that bragging about wars isn't exactly a great starting point for the UK. The baby boomers statistically have had it the easiest from a financial perspective in being able to buy a house, get a job and sort the basics in life out. They then lecture the younger generation (who have it far easier in other ways to be fair) about how they need to 'believe' in the country and have the 'grit' of those who fought in the war over Brexit. And they're not even the ones who bloody fought in it. It's absolutely bizarre. It's Daily Mail propaganda regurgitation. And people who don't really read anything else fall for it, hook line and sinker. Apologies in advance if most of that doesn't apply to you Redprintt, it might not even apply to anyone here, it's just you opened up a point that I wanted to make as a generalisation and not directly at you.
People experiences and societies always have relevance. It is what helps to shape us as human beings. It shapes our societies and politics. We as individuals will often inherit and display the same qualities as our parents and forebears, I do. Societies do likewise. Societies display collective mindsets. You choose negativity. We can choose to display the spirit of our history.
If the baby boomers' experience of the war has relevance, then by that logic it's perfectly legitimate for me to wheel out the bravery of the Battle of Hastings! Societies displaying collective mindsets is clearly evident for both remain and leave - it will always be prevalent. That doesn't make a war 70/80 years ago in any way relevant. 'We survived without the EU before!' has just as much justification as 'we survived without computers before!'. I certainly don't choose negativity in day-to-day life either. Purely in this case, you may perceive it as negativity, I perceive it as realism, we will both twist it to fit within our narratives, whether we're conscious of it or not.
This isn't about wartime and I doubt the previous comments were meant to imply that. Maybe just suggesting how a strong leader can unite a country (in whatever direction that might be) as opposed to tearing it apart through being ineffective in the role. The case for a "leader" of the people is very strong at this time to deal with an issue that's being used to beat this country's inhabitants into submission on terms that suit no one but those who are trying to impose them. Strong leadership doesn't necessarily lead to success, but it gives the United Kingdom a voice that demands to be heard rather than meekly asks to be. If it doesn't come off the we have a perfect right to plough our own furrow in the future rather than admitting at the start that we would never take that option. Giftwrapping the upper hand to those with whom we are trying to negotiate is absolute bonkers.
It is not logical. Events in recent history shape behaviours. Yes. Both are choices. You may want to breath in and think about that statement. Its irrelevant to you. I grew up in a family that had individuals carrying the emotional and physical scars. It is very relevant to others. Principles and culture cross generations. It is more than a perception. Your relentless posting is heavily slanted to negativity. The following is yours. A opinion turned into a negative statement of fact (?).
I meant in a wider scale. My attitude towards Brexit is negative/realistic/however you want to portray it, because I see the realistic effect of it as a negative. On a life scale, I certainly do not choose negativity. What would be the point?
Your perception of anything pre 5 maybe 10 years ago is very "off the cuff and absolutely bizzare" the mix you try to sew into a post very higgly piggly . The baby boomers .. the 2 generation of what was left after the atrocity of WW2 … NEVER HAD ITEASY..... and the funny thing is your comment leads into the ERA that was around 1970 to 1980 when the labour led or union led labour party tried to bring the government down by countless strikes .. we needed a strong leader then and we got one … but it was tough for a few years 3.4m unemployed .. I was made redundant .. WIFE 2 KIDS A MORTGAGE AT 15% PER ANNUM …. BUT as ROD is worried about on another post how long if we left EU would we have to bite the bullet? Well back then about 2 -3 years and most of the 1000 odd I used to work with never looked back .. what had to be done was done and we ALL have better lives for it now. Roll back the years comparity with the present Labour PARTY … WHAT SEEMS TO BE THEIR SOLE AIM... well being as obstructive as possible with government policies so called backing THE voters wishes to leave the EU ..oh HANG ON they have just announced they did so bad in the EURO elections and the LIB DEMS DID SO WELL.. time to jump ship and in mid stream decide to support REMAIN … without any consideration of the democratic will of the people saying we LEAVE … CORBOLIKS singular vision in life is to be PM . he survived a vote of no confidence to become leader and it went to his head … I can dictate what I WANT to the minnions of this party to get what I want and SOD WHAT IT COSTS he now thinks he is in a stronger position by following the LIB DEM line [and Greens] he will have a better chance. ...HIS AIM to try and succeed where the labour party failed by in the days of Red Ken and co ..
????? My Grandad fought in the war. My Mrs father did. you make a lot of mad points and comparing that to 1066 is another !!!
ROB, I was replying to your comment that a 'strong leader' won't make a difference - abstract as you put it. Yes both my parents served in WW2 and yes both told me harrowing tales and also of great joy and relief. I shouldn't have mentioned Churchill the leader as it takes you away from the point that a 'strong leader' really does make a difference. There are numerous 'strong leaders' I could quote but as this is a football forum - Alex Ferguson ?
my grand father fought in WW1 lost 5 fingers and his sight … my mother and father fought in WW2 my dad died before he was 60 because he got severely scarred after a kamikaze hit his ship and had to breath hot oily smoke for yonks before rescued and it severely affected his lungs … my mother lived till she was 92+ and her stories of the struggle to bring up 4 boys and make to 1990 were pretty much only told after this date! A lot of what she said I could remember as having happened … coupons ...hot long summers and cold snowy winters … people today have it so so so much easier .. dole money food banks free money ! …"buy now pay later" not "pay now buy later" .. some of BCFC ROBS comments are well under researched or experienced he should learn to think before he spouts ………….. ps don't know what my relatives did in 1066 family tree on one side only goes back to 1645 on the other 1749 ...
Rob is relatively young,ask your parents who mums and dads would have been involved in wars and their family members. Ask people that have lost family and friends in the Falklands or fighting ISIS.
What's your point? I have family members who fought in wars before and after the Falklands. I have family members who have just come back from being at war in recent years. At no point have I criticised those who bravely support us so I'm not sure what you're trying to prove?
Are you a looney? They are talking about world wars. As a nation we haven’t had to get the country back in order over those wars have we? Also why has everyone on here a football forum got to rubbish Rob all the time and speak to him like he’s just transcended into this world. Of course he’s got family members who fought in the wars we all have. Some worse than others.
Ok, here goes... Believe what you like. That's the rights you have due to 'strong leaders' of the past that has allowed us to be free today. But just a word of caution for you, these experts that you mentioned are probably the same experts who wanted us to join the Euro and said the pound will crash if we don't. The same experts who said if Brexit wins the referendum, the next day the economy will crash. The same experts who seem to get a lot wrong. Now when these experts open their mouth, it would be wise to believe the opposite will happen. I have said many times now, parliament today is a shambles. Weak folk on all sides of the debate. The EU must be laughing their heads off having to deal with a bunch of fools and they probably pissed themselves with laughter when parliament decided to take our strongest weapon off the negotiation table - no deal. If you don't believe we will be in a better position with a 'strong leader' at the helm, someone who will actually get something from the EU then fair enough. But excuse me and others if we don't share your negative outlook. To me, the only reason why you don't want a 'strong leader' is because you know such a person will make brexit happen, which goes against your wishes. Deep down though, you know a 'strong leader' in any anything can only improve ones fortunes. And on your other note, me liking Cliftonville's comment means I contradicted myself, not sure how me liking this line of his comment.... "The biggest UK party in the European parliament by far will be called BREXIT. And 60% of the population did not care (be arsed) enough about the EU to vote to prevent this." ..... means I contradicted myself. Oh well..... Have a nice day
Some posters need to get a thicker skin. It maybe a football forum, but other subjects get discussed and debated. If you involve yourself in these threads, then be prepared to take some flak from those who don't agree with you. I'm not talking about unecessary abuse and rudeness in posts on here, just opposite opinions being expressed. Age is not a deciding factor on who is right or wrong - that transcends the number of years you've spent on this planet . I don't see the fact that Rob is young has anything to do with it. He commented and got answered. If you don't like the responses you get on a public forum, you shouldn't get involved.
