Lots of remainers are calling for a people's vote... but what if the people vote to leave again? They're kinda assuming it will go in remain's favour this time, and hasn't recent events taught anything about the dangers of assuming?
The subtle difference is that people are more informed about the consequences of their decision and the detrimental effects that leaving may have on their lives now.
Plus the fact that this time the Remain campaign won’t make the mistake of taking people for granted like they did last time. Hopefully they’ll play dirty, to the extent of calling out the hypocrisy of prominent Leavers like Rees-Mogg, who is investing a large part of his considerable fortune in Brexit.
If they vote to leave again, there you have certainty. It then becomes a choice between two options: May's deal (or something similar), or no deal. I'd expect a deal similar to May's to pass then.
I mean, it’s not like there’s a clear cut plan now. If they could agree on a way to leave, you all would have already done so. How could it be worse? If they vote to Remain, you remain. Problem solved. If they vote to leave again, then you leave. People will fight over an exit plan and nothing will be resolved, the clock will run out and there will be a hard Brexit. Just like what is going to happen anyway. The reason why they do not want a vote is because the hard exit types have nothing to gain. Theirs is the most likely outcome as things stand, and as a bonus they won’t have to take any responsibility for it.
I respect the differing views on here and the people’s right to express it. However I sometimes think we all forget that at the outset all main parties (not including Farages cronies) were for staying. So in my view the remain camp are more likely to be the winners here. One way or tother........I really don’t see why you need another vote. I agree there were flaws by both camps in the referendum. In truth none of us really know how we would fare even if we stayed or go for that matter. It’s all innuendo depending on which expert you choose to believe. I really think that TM needs to get hold of a cross party forum and approach this from a different direction. There is already rumblings in the EU that maybe we have a point about the open borders policy. (Which seems to be our stumbling block)
Shame you couldn’t have spoken, as I did, to even a few of those on the march today Beddy. The range of different backgrounds, and most important, ages, was staggering. By leaving under any circumstances we are betraying the young people of this country, and a lot of them were too young to vote in 2016. Shouldn’t they have a chance to decide their future?
I too can see all the differing views on here and respect them. It's no secret that I am a remainer, but what gets me is the total screw up by TM to deliver any sort of Brexit. My voting habits over the years actually probably mirror Vin's, but there is no way I could vote for a Tory govt in the next election. To put it into perspective, I will be 50 this year so in 32 years of being able to vote I have probably voted 95% of the time for a Tory govt. IMO Brexit will be a disaster - I hope I am wrong, but I have yet to see a valid argument for it. However, I see the need for another vote - let the country vote on facts rather than fiction. We have a clearer view of what we are voting for, even if Farage and Co have reared their ugly heads again to muddy the waters. I say that even though all along I have said that we the people shouldn't have the deciding vote - we as a collective just do not understand the implications enough. Let us have our say and then the politicians debate it. The have done a good enough job in the last 2 ½ years....
Lummy chilco...... you could say that for every referendum.........if you had another referendum there still would be people who were still too young to have voted. Who might have a differing view to either of us. I agree with one point though.......leaving without some sort of agreement is ludicrous........ while I still believe the out vote is right I would prefer to go back to the days of just the common market. No political ties.......that in my view would be an acceptable departure. As I said before numerous times it needed to be a cross party negotiation.
I mean, the EU isn't going to suddenly throw up its hands and tear up half its treaties, no matter how compelling the argument. Wherever those rumblings might be, they aren't being turned into actionable policy any decade soon. There is a simple reason for that: frictionless borders for goods but not workers would lead to all manner of perverse incentives and economic dislocation. That is why it exists: it's not some silly hippie policy meant to mix Europe's population into one big happy family, it's meant to ensure that the benefits of unfettered trade do not accumulate only in one place and for one people.
Look at the demographics of the 2016 vote. Most over-65’s voted to leave, while the vast majority of 18-24’s voted to stay. That isn’t going to change, except there will be more young people voting in the next one. Personally I would rather be run by the EU than the shower of idiots in Westminster, not to mention the British civil service where the school you went to matters more than the skills you have.
I think there has to be exceptions..........large territorial countries can accommodate these people.....islands cannot go on for ever accommodating loads and loads of people. Our green spaces are being taken up as we speak. Controlled migration is a must in my opinion. Nothing to do with race or religion or any thing like that.
And soft borders have allowed the decentralisation of industry, so that different parts of things are made in different specialist factories all over Europe, with the parts coming together on a just-in-time basis. Hard borders between us and Europe effectively rule us out of the party completely, and we’re not going to be able to make the whole of anything for decades, if ever.
Twice as many immigrants enter the UK from outside the EU as from inside, so how does Brexit help control immigration? Also, Scotland need even more immigrants than ever, as their population is declining, so how does Brexit help them?
Now there’s an idea.......all the illegal immigrants we catch we send to Scotland.........now that might persuade me to vote to remain................ (only joking folks honest) hmmm
OK, before this gets silly I’m going to bed. Good night all, and Bollocks to Brexit, as I must have shouted a thousand times today!
