I guess that it's easier to have pride and feelings of nostalgia about the country of your birth when you live on the other side of the World. I completely agree with CBK about everything that is wrong about the jingoistic media and politicians using National pride and identity for their own narrow minded ends
National pride and supporting the overinflated egos who represent our football team are two entirely different things. We are still held in high regard around the world for many things. Sadly, our press chooses to ignore the positive and highlight the negative.
I am proud to be English and do not put British down on any forms, but I would say, I have lost significant interest in the national side since WC2010. I just can't get excited in the same way I can for Saints. Saints > England
It disappoints me to hear people saying they do not have pride in their country. As for politicians I can see why they give the impression they are only in it for their own ends. The real reality of it is, they love their country as much as any one. The difference is they are involved in making decisions that we on the street do not fully understand. Simply because there is so many different points of view for any given subject. For the last 10/11 years this country like so many others has been living under a cloud, because of the radical threat and of course the economic threat. As a nation we are pulling in so many different directions and nothing seems to be working. The same can be said in regards to the sport we have had so many disappointments and although we have had some good wins the performance has been very mediocre. The game last evening a prime candidate for bore of the century.....that despite winning. England doesn't do things in style at the moment on the football field. England the country though........she is my country and my passion.....I have served her and would serve her again should need arise, although I might have to dye my hair and lose a few pounds!! If she wanted me I would quite happily go again. To be honest despite some of the things written in this thread so would most of you!!
I am proud of the hertiage of this country and pround to call myself and Englishman. I struggle to understand at times the society that we have become; but take pride in the service and the sacrefices of our armed forces who deserve our utmost respect. Having set out my stall on being proud to be English - I take no notice of the England Football team - they play with no pride, no commitment - I feel no attatchment to them. I am pleased with the rise of the Enlgand cricket team and adore watching the England Rugby Union team - i the last two world cups they exhibited all the commitment, guts and determination to get to back to back finals. Utterly professional in their approach - they have shown all the attributes sadly lacking in our football team. I do not think they are quite ready to win the world cup this time - given another 12 to 18 mths they might have been - but they will sing the national anthem before the game, they will play with pride and commitment and even in defeat I will be pround of them and my country they represent.
I don't think anyone questioned their pride in being English, British or whatever, in everyday life. What they questioned is why they have to put up with following a national football side that constantly flatters to deceive, containing professionals that bear no relationship to the people who follow the sport. If they aren't already, most of these guys are millionaires within 20 or so weeks, even after tax. For playing football, for chrissakes..! Not saving lives, or risking their necks day in and day out, but for doing something they actually love doing, anyway. Most of them say they'd do it for nothing, if they could. Well then play as if you mean it then, is my answer. In all honesty [and I really mean this], I think a side picked from the best the Football League has to offer could perform every bit as well as the current England team do, and almost certainly better. They may not have the potential to perform as well, but when did the last Premiership England team perform to their potential against worthy opposition..? I tell you what too - I'd cheer that side on, too.
National pride is a dangerous thing sometimes and there generally is no sense in this "my country is better than yours" mentality. In a strictly footballing sense it's fine, but there are too many morons out there who can't tell the difference and it breeds violence and even spills over into politics. Patriotism is pointless and meaningless and I'll have no part in it. "How I wish that somewhere there existed an island for those who are wise and of goodwill. In such a place even I would be an ardent patriot." - Albert Einstein.
Indeed it is, but even Einstein, in his quote, is proclaiming loyalty to something. There is nothing wrong with pride, but it must go hand in hand with humility. And that's something that is sadly lacking in today's society.
Unfortunately there is an inherent selfishness in English society these days. Too many young people growing up are only interested in material things and want them as soon as they can get them. They don't want to start at the bottom and expect a high earning job as soon as they apply for one. Alternatively, they just want to not work and live on handouts. This is also present in the current generation. Gone are the days when the country worked as one for a common cause and it's all about individuality. Footballers, are the epitome of this. They get fast cars and high wages at young ages without having to "work" for them. Then you have the Big Brother instant fame desperation and Katie Price wannabes. These are the people who grab all the headlines and have become role models. I desperately want to be proud of my country.
Everytime someone mentions north korea all i remember is the film Team America, with Kim Jun il or however you spell it lol.
Guys and gals......This thread is getting a wee bit heavy on the political front. Lets all keep to the subject matter please and leave the Koreans and whoever else to their own devices.......The only other option would be to close the thread down....BT
I doubt the North Koreans would be able to access this forum, so not much of a chance of offending any of them. In all seriousness though, I believe that this subject matter comes hand in hand with political debate, and "English pride" is a dodgy subject at the best of times, so if you wish to avoid that kind of debate it would probably be in your best interests to close the thread.
Yep, leaving the North Koreans out of this [possibly the South Koreans too] is probably a very good idea..! I think the problem we all have is squaring the circle that is having any association with these selected sportsmen who, on the face of it, lead enchanted lives, doing what they love to do, and getting paid incredible amounts of money on a weekly basis. I remember reading somewhere of MLT, who would pop his head into the office, come contract time, to be told of his improved conditions, and say... yeah, that's fine. The most he ever received weekly was £8,000 + extras. Now that's just about in touch with some supporters. Not many, I'll grant you, but at least people could imagine what it was like. But nowadays one or two of these elite are on £200,000 every 7 days, whether they are playing or not, and many are on £100,000 per week. The average person hardly makes that much in 5 years, so one can see when expectation levels are high of these people. And they are not beyond criticism, whatever Mr Rooney may feel.
Just like to point out I'm only visiting Oz at present and was born and raised in England am extremely proud to be English but seeing things from outside at present makes me realize how things have changed back home and in my humble opinion not much for the better and like a previous post football is a good example of the get rich mentality and a totally disrespect of law and order. Look at the way they argue and harass the ref and linesman at just about every decision ,,,money and winning seems everything ,how many of you come away from a game when saints have lost an just thought oh well good game tried there best better luck next game ?. I see so many posts on here people ripping to pieces different players for a bad game ,,as if they do it on purpose ,,just relax enjoy the game and move on,,
Interesting observation SaintinOz.........It is true by going to different countries it does give you a chance to see first hand what is wrong/right about your own country. Australia is a growing country it has a very diverse culture now compared with say 10 years ago, that will alter quite considerably over the next 10 years as well. Mainly because of the influx of Japanese, Chinese and of course middle eastern Asians. Their sport will have to cope with it as well although their cricket is just about including second generation Asians, although their Rugby has been doing it for a while. Watching soccer or Aussie rules, cricket or rugby is their discipline any better than ours over here? No I don't think it is although I will have to admit my experience is only based on one partly viewed soccer match and one Rugby game. Perhaps not the best to judge on such minimalistic experiences.........
Would agree about the discipline in Oz they are at times no better,but they do have a basic honest blunt approach,and that could be down to there lack of class system,,would also admit that the weather plays a huge influence of there outlook and again being away from UK it shows how the climate does affect the way of life and possible attitude,,the locals are also worried they are slowly going the same way as UK,,,am back in uk end of October so just in time for winter yippee ,, bad planning or what. Here for Rugby world cup thoigh so will have great fun wearing English jersey around Sydney . Been called a pommy bastard so many times it's funny.
