Great fire of London, good came of that, got rid of the plague, and they learned to build houses further apart - actually much like the EU, it's a plague and we are way too close to brussels. #SwanVesta
We’ll still be close to Brussels - we won’t actually be moving, Europe will still be on our doorstep. Like getting a divorce and living in the same house; it’ll just be **** for everybody, no one wins.
1 Remain 2 Remain 3 No need to remove the backstop, the problem is the transition period and no clarity as to the final UK-EU relationship. 4 Nope, the backstop is what was agreed to protect the GFA and there is no such thing as the will of the people except in the heads of dictators who want to prevent the public having the ability to have a continued input 5 Remain, there is no deal that is better for the UK. I'll take a SM + CU if leavers really want to have no say and accept all the rules. 6. It'll happen at some point and when it does I expect the unionists to cause trouble. 7 Green
Leftie and Dan gone for the Greens, must admit they've crossed my mind. So what do they have to offer to persuade you lads to go for them, apart from environmental stuff?
I disagree on a lot of things that the greens stand for, but they are the most progressive and their support for a universal basic income is probably the key thing. Other than the obvious caring for the environment and wanting a sustainable future
Absolutely agree on the environment but is it not a wasted vote in the UK. It just seems we pay the environment a lot of lip service in the UK but very little else. Don't get me wrong, as it stands with a choice between Labour and Conservatives, I could well be putting my cross in the Green box. What's their views on the NHS? probably one of the most important factors to me and based on the NHS alone and if i had to choose only between Tory or Lab, I would probably go Lab. And what's the Greens policy on homelessness, something Labour are proven in resolving?
My constituency votes 60% tory so every vote that takes the Tories over 40% or is for an opposition party is wasted. Greens policies are the closest you will get to wanting a sustainable system working for the people, rather than solely for profit. Given the choice between trusting a green party and PFI labour in the NHS, I know which I would choose.
It would be easier to show you the manifesto. Kate Raworth explains it best with her doughnut economics. It shouldn't be about maximising growth and growing beyond a sustainable level. The aim must be to use the economy to raise living standards. This needs to be applied on every stage and the greens have a bigger presence in the EU than the UK, which is why our environmental standards have been improved by our membership. You would have to describe what you see as EU ideology as to me it is a representative of EU politics. At the moment EPP hold the reigns, in May that could change with the rise of German greens and nationalist parties.
ok so i guess you care about the environment, so first question that comes to mind, did the EU not force out small farmers, local farmers, in favour of the big land owners, for mass production and profit. I listened to an interview some months back involving a very strong remainer, he was asked a question, if you had to name one thing, that you would side with leave on what would it be, his reply, how the EU destroyed local farmers. So what environmental impact does the EU have with this policy of mass production of said land owner, and exporting goods around the EU, instead of local farmers selling to local people. Now i know there would be a wide range of products we could not have in this country, but we are talking about environmental impact here. As i said earlier we seem to play lip service to it. Take your supermarkets for example, the government introduced what is basically a carrier bag tax. What has happened since then, well i visited Sainsbury's recently, they no longer had any loose produce, everything was in plastic bags, in fact i suggest it has got worse across some supermarkets since the introduction of the levy on carrier bags. So isn't the environment really about, doing as i say but not doing as i do?
Yes farms have grown in size to be more competitive, yes local produce is better than buying from further afield. Staying or leaving the EU won't fix this because our policies are driven by neo liberals. Carrier bag reuse is a good thing, single use plastic packaging is not and legislation to restrict packaging to sustainable/recyclable forms should've happened a long time ago. That black plastic is still allowed when it cannot be read by the sorting machines is baffling. For too long we have protected pretty packaging and now we reap the cost, without national and Supranational effort then this is unlikely to change.
You couldn't be more wrong about the EU forcing out small farmers; absolutely the opposite is true. The Common Agricultural Policy was specifically designed to subsidise and keep afloat small farms and regional practices, as is very much the case in France. The facf that farming in the UK has increasingly become the preserve of large scale agri-business has far more to do with who owns the land in England (and Scotland).
I think you might find there are a fair few remainers that might disagree with that view. As i said, it was the one specific concern a staunch remainer had. Either that or he was an uneducated prick who should have voted leave.
Voted leave like all the other uneducated pricks, you mean? Maybe we should have two Europes; one for the civilised modernists, and one for the Neanderthals? If the Brexit referendum proves one thing, it’s that the European Enlightenment (google it) only ever reached slightly less than half the population.
Funny really. I've not made a claim to anything and me and leftie were having a decent debate, until you popped in. You appear to claim to know the ins and outs of everything Archers. I mention farmers, you appear to be educated on that too. Typical militant closed shop mentality. I used to think you was a reasonably intelligent guy, you're becoming a bigger twat by the day. But no worries i doubt you will ever reach the ignorant levels of levers, you surpassed that decades ago
I seem to have got into a bad habit of a) reading your posts and b) responding to them. In future I shall endeavour to do neither. But it would really help if you could try not to keep flaunting your ignorance so spectacularly
So the staunch remainer was wrong about small farmers being driven out due to the EU. He certainly seemed to know his stuff, maybe he was actually a farmer rather than a postie that reads historical books.
