Off Topic we [ BCFC 606 ers ] debated IN or OUT and now

I [ expletive ] hoping not … he is a death nell… lives just down the road

 

I usually stay away from political threads here because it gets ugly in terms of mud-slinging.

What I will say is, the EU referendum result is the only reason Teresa May's in power and it's the thing that will end her stint as PM also.

Hers was an impossible situation to deliver an EU exit that people would support, because people want to eat their cake and have it too, i.e. have all the benefits of EU membership, whilst ditching the bad qualities, which was never going to happen, whoever was in charge. I've seen some saying they would've loved Trump to be in charge of negotiations, but that would only have ended up in a no-deal due to his stubbornness, which in some cases is a strength, but not this one.

Their have been ridiculous suggestions made by some that the EU needs the UK more that it needs them because we import so much and so we'd have the upper hand at the negotiating table, but the reality is that they were always likely to make things as difficult as possible because they're setting an example. If we got out with too good a deal, you'd see lots of other countries follow suit over the next decade or two.

Nobody knew, and still don't know for certain, the full ramifications for leaving, though it's probably fair to say that the majority of people would be worse off in the short-term. It could still be a good thing in the long-term, but that's the risk we've taken and it's down to us to make the best of it.

 

I still struggle to see how it in any way can be a good thing in the long term. There's nothing to suggest it in any way from what I've seen.

 

I think the idea is that we'd be released from the shackles of EU regulations/restrictions and so could benefit from that freedom - the problem is whether those benefits outweigh those from being in the open market. Some will undoubtedly benefit, but others certainly won't either. It'll probably take the better part of 20 years for us to be able to look back and see if it was ultimately worth it.

 

Yeah that's fair enough I'm just not sure what these 'shackles' are. I've heard bits about fishing and some stuff (which I think is nonsense) about the technology industry. But I'm not an expert whatsoever so happy to be proven wrong. I just think it would have to be one hell of a benefit for it to be an overall positive.

 

not really true, Cameron stated before his last election he was going to resign the post after 2 years or so. the referendum came along as PROMISED and went leave so he did TM GOT THE JOB! had it been remain we would have elections within the conservatives to select his replacement this year and vote next... she was deemed best suited replacement at the time "unbelievably considering" …..

sums it up, have posted the same similar comments previous the commentator outside parliament when interviewing the inevitable TORY +LABOUR mp suddenly paused in his stride ….. a classic " are you telling me they barmier et al are deliberately making it hard and giving little to avert others following if it is sen to be easy! " HOOORAY at last someone else has cottoned on

the fishing industry … years ago you could go fishing .. in the sea, beach or boat and catch to many fish for your own consumption put em back share them! When our waters were within the EU FISH STOCKS RAPIDLY DEPLETED
and new rules were implemented by the unelected members running Brussels …. it resulted in worst scenarios for the poor fish ...lying off shore were massive Russian factory ships that all but decimated some fish stocks like herring and mackerel up north... quotas were maintained via weight and undersize were thrown back ….mostly dead or consumed by predators that learned to follow the boats for easy pickings BUT these were bigger and bigger boats from non UK countries …. In theory even LUXEMBOURG could have a fleet based somewhere! ? with fishing in our hands ….
As for technology well that will always remain an international thing … depends on who "invents" and how they sell it on? … I guess

 

Fair enough but regardless, I don't think that's worth the cost leaving the EU.

 

The disaster was offering a choice of 2 when one half of the choice was unknown.
People who voted for Brexit have differing ideas as to what that means - but NONE of the ideas were already on the table - they were all hypothetical.
That’s why I voted Remain. Not for any love-in with Brussels or Merkel - far from it. It was the fear of this type of situation that drove my choice.

 

To the people who voted leave, what is it you actually wanted and do you think that’s what you’re going to get?

 

Fear, that's what the elite, the BBC and Junker thrive on.
Ffs we're something like the 6th biggest economy in the world. Call their bluff - the EU is going to implode, it's just a matter of time.
Pre the vote in the 70s how the hell do you think we managed - Think about it.
Back then the French, in particular, only wanted us to join because we found oil in the North Sea. That was after a few years earlier in the late 60s DeGaule saying NON in every national newspaper headline to us joining and we were all issued with petrol ration vouchers.
It won't come to it but I'd be happy, like both my parents who fought in WW2, to put up with rationing just to be rid of Brussels.
R&W have a look at history when the liberal elite, Halifax and the rest, who wanted to appease Hitler. It's all appeasement now.
And have a look at the elite who told us we had to join the Euro. The same who want to sabotage the referendum vote.

Don't be scared of your own shadow.

 

Clusterf*ck is a perfect word for the whole situation. But, in all truth, did anyone expect anything else after the result of the vote was known?

As far as the EU is concerned, I've no doubt that the first line of Michel Barnier's brief was "make it as difficult for the UK as possible and if you can really **** them over, all the better!" The last thing they wanted was for us to come away with a good deal as that would have made it more tempting for other member states to give it a go.

Then you have the posturings of the likes of Boris the Buffoon and The Upper Class Twit of the Year, both of whom say what they like, when they like, safe in the knowledge that they will never be in a position to take over from May and supposedly lead us to the promised land!!

The only thing that can now make it any worse is if the Prime Minister took the keys of No.10 around to Corbyn's house tonight and says "Crack on then Jezzer - I've had enough of this bollocks. Let's see how you fare!!"

 

I wouldn't give a toss either but I think we'd be in a very, very, small minority!!

 

You know what the reasons are ROD they have been plastered on social media for over 12 months

 

Quite. And yet a huge proportion of the Brexit vote was by those who vote Conservative, the exact guys who have managed to make the poor poorer and the rich richer in the past 8 years, dismantling our public services and making life more miserable for everybody in general. As you say, in the 6th biggest economy in the world. How does that work?

I echo RoD's comments above. Those who voted leave, what did you want and why?

Is it immigration? Well we're never going to be able to stop freedom of movement unless we leave the customs union.
Was it to leave the customs union? If so, why? Considering it gives us far more than we could ever give to it, as we're seeing with all these Brexit predictions.

I just don't get it. I was a bit skeptical going into the referendum campaign and I leaned towards the Leave side, but not this type of leave, and looking back I don't think the 'ideal' scenario for leaving even exists. Every one screws us in one way or another, there's just no point. The EU has its faults but it's better than this sh*tshow.

 

I can see a No Deal looming large and even a postponement the way things are going.

A General Election wont help, and Corbyn isn't trustworthy, although I'm fairly sure Labour would win it by a neck if one were called. I'm not convinced a change of PM will change anything for the better either even if there is a vote of 'No Confidence' which seems likely.

I have no love for Theresa May but she's always been in a no win situation.

The rest of the world are having a laugh at our expense right now and who can blame them.

It's the biggest political mess ever, and the Referendum should never have been held when it was without more clarity.

 

Many many thousands of labour voters opted for Leave.

 

Exactly this. I actually quite like Corbyn and in general I'm not a huge fan of Theresa May. But an election right now would do nothing but cause more unrest and trouble, and while Theresa May's leadership has been anything but 'strong and stable', David Cameron absolutely threw the next Tory leader under the bus. There is no one out there who could have sorted this mess out, so May has just been riding the storm and has kept it together quite admirably in my opinion.

As I said, I'm not a fan, but the way she's handled it amongst all the backstabbing and pressure from all sides, she's a credit to women in my opinion who are clearly underrepresented in politics.

Oh absolutely. I was just referring to the hypocrisy of those in particular.

 

And every one voted for Corbyn in the general election after the referendum.
The stupid Theresa May thought they'd vote for her after they voted leave.
The red north would vote red even if they were Turkeys voting for Christmas.

 

My view is that now we know exactly what the "Brexit" deal is - it's time for another vote

 

Thankfully I am not engaged in any way with Brexit because we have enough trouble with our southern idiot. My only comments are that they didn't want us in the first place and so why did we expect open arms and cooperation from people who had been poking us in the eyes for centuries? Since my departure from England in 1976 the country has gone from a green and pleasant land to a cesspool of arrivals bent on doing whatever is in their power to destroy what apparently was their dream of a better life. The most regrettable part of Bexit will be that you are left with the mess created by policies of other nationalities which essentially decimated the infrastructure that made Britain great. The whole world has gone mad and politicians must bear the brunt of the responsibility and poor Theresa May will get the undeserved clobbering from what is obviously a divided country when it come to the decision that you either love or despise. I will be in England around the time the divorce is finalised and will listen to my friend's opinions during my 10 weeks in the Canary Islands.

Good luck to the land of my birth and let's hope all those on the other side of the channel look at our departure as a sign that all is not well in the Union and maybe others will use it as a template for total renegotiation of the deal for all without the exorbitant costs of membership and economy strapping restrictions.

Meanwhile back to Donald Trump EH?