Article: Best vs Carroll - Goals and Assists | Football, Newcastle

Some of you asked, so I will oblige.

Before I begin, I want to clarify a few things:

- This is purely a comparison between the number of goals and assists the players have scored. It's not a comparison about overall ability or skill, which is unquantifiable.

- Many people have asked who we'll bring in to 'fill in the void' Carroll left. This is a comparison to see how much of the void Best has managed to fill so far in-terms of goals and assists which actually contributed those all-important points.

- These are statistics facts about the most important and essential things in football - RESULTS.

This isn't to say that Best is better than Carroll, or as good as Carroll, it's just the facts which you guys can use to make your own judgements.

Goals

Andy Carroll - 19 apps - 11 goals
Leon best - 13 apps - 8 goals

Andy Carroll goals and points contributed:

Newcastle 1 - 3 Manchester City
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 3 - 1 Liverpool
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 1 - 1 Chelsea
Points contributed = 1

Bolton 5 - 1 Newcastle
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 1 - 2 - Blackburn
Points contributed = 0

Arsenal 0 - 1 Newcastle
Points contributed = 2

West ham 1 - 2 Newcastle
Points contributed = 2

Wolves 1 - 1 Newcastle
Points contributed = 1

Newcastle 6 - 0 Aston Villa
Points contributed = 0

11 goals total = 6 points contributed

Leon Best goals and points scored:

Newcastle 5 - 0 West Ham
Points contributed = 0

Arsenal 4 - 4 Newcastle
Points contributed = 1

Birmingham 0 - 2 Newcastle
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 1 - 2 Everton
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 2 - 1 Fulham
Points contributed = 3

8 goals scored = 4 points contributed

Verdict:

Carroll - 11 goals total = 6 points contributed - 54% goals got points
Best - 8 goals scored = 4 points contributed - 50% goals got points

Andy Carroll - 19 apps - 11 goals - 57% app/goal conversion rate
Leon Best - 13 apps - 8 goals - 61% app/goal conversion rate


Assists


Carroll

Newcastle 6 - 0 Villa
1 Nolan goal assisted by Carroll
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle Utd 2 - 2 Wigan
1 Coloccini goal assisted by Carroll
Points contributed = 1

Newcastle 5 - 1 Sunderland
1 Nolan goal assisted by Carroll
1 Ameobi goal assisted by Carroll
Points contributed = 0

West brom 3 - 1 Newcastle
1 Lovenkrands goal assisted by Carroll
Points contributed = 0

Newcastle 3 - 1 Liverpool
1 Nolan goal assisted by Carroll
Points contributed = 0

Points directly contributed from assists = 1


Best

He apparently has one assist from last season but I can't find out which match it was in. Can anyone shed any light? I'll update this if they can.

Verdict:


Carrol points contributed from goals AND assists = 7 = 63% gls/asts got points
Best points contributed from goals AND assists = 4 = 50% gls/asts got points (so far)

One thing we can confidently say, is that despite all of Carroll's evident potential and ability, the actual point-scoring goals and assists he contributed while he was with us was not difficult to fill, and Best has almost managed it, with a slightly lower percentage over fewer games.

Also, it appears that Carroll perhaps suffered from the old 'Berbatov syndrome' a little more than people think. Yes he scored a lot of goals, but they were often bunched together to add to wins we already had. The same goes for his assists. Most individual goals he did score were just consolidations during losing games. I've also seen little evidence of this habit changing now he's moved to Liverpool.

Take this as you wish!

 

This is a very elaborate thread, what are you trying to prove?

 

Best won one of the penalties in the Arsenal game, does that count as an assist?

 

.

 

Assists aren't counted by Opta for the following (if I recall correctly): penalties won, deflected pass, rebound of a shot

 

Not sure. Anyone?

 

So you're not trying to prove anything?

Oh ok

Well congrats on that

 

Do all articles have to be making somebody agree with you about something?

 

Trying to prove (not prove, as such, necessarily, but at least point out the facts for others to make their own judgments) that Best can/did fill the Carroll void in terms of goals and assists.

Clear?

 

The only Leon Best assist I can think of is Andy Carroll's last minute equaliser against Swansea in the promotion season. Brilliant cross. But that was in the Champ - can't think of a Prem assist

 

Best is more of a poacher or finisher than creator really. I imagine Ba, Cabaye, Benny, Obertan, Marv to be creating for Best really. So no problems there.

Fox in the box, is ol' Besty. Would be happy for Ba and Best to start up front together to be honest.

 

When you have to go looking so hard, I think the statistics lose their value somewhat.
The fact that "opta" decide what counts as an assist is just one reason i think that particular statistic is pretty useless. Additionally, "assists" isn't a great reflection of a player's influence on the game. Nasri only got one last season if I remember rightly and a few seasons ago when everyone would have agreed that Iniesta was one of the most in form and influential players in the world he only had 3 assists. The final pass may not really have been the decisive or creative one. A player may have ran the length of the pitch before passsing to a team mate who passes it on another couple of yards - who really made the goal? In any other example, the most important contribution to a goal may be an off the ball run that drew defenders out of the way.

For the most part people should forget analysing individual statistics, watch football, and form their own opinion on how effective the individual players are.

 

This. Don't think we should be playing long balls to Best - same thing applies to Ranger if/when he ever plays again - I think despite his height, he is more of a striker who plays off the big man

 

I'd have to disagree with that

 

How can you say this goal provided 0 points? the game was at 0-0 before this goal was scored and this goal could arguably be considered the catalyst for the win.... I would contribute 2 points to this personally.

 

This, really. Goals change games to be honest. It's all in the opinion really. But would it still have ended 2-1 if Nolan hadn't scored that first goal? Not necessarily. And if you take Carroll out of that game entirely, then you'd lose a goal AND assist - making it only 1-1. There are flaws, admittedly.

 

Because any idiot can make bullshit up and then call "stats" to try to make it look good. Utter dross.

 

That was my original point

The first of these threads was terrible

This one has somehow smashed it though

 

Alright guys, calm down, don't take it out on Chappaz. He's merely stating statistics and letting us make up our own minds. People requested these stats, and Chappaz found them. Chill out.

 

I'm keeping this factual and quantifiable. Once you start including theoretical catalysts, it becomes an impossible and flawed comparison. Adding 'coulds' or 'woulds' or 'ifs' just completely sucks any meaning out of the solid indesputable results these players brought to NUFC.

All I know is that if Carroll didn't provide that assist, and that goal wasn't scored, we still would have won 2-1, so we can't count that assist as providing any worthwhile points.

My point is, Carroll simply added to an existing win.

But of course, all of the Carroll lovers and Best haters still can't comprehend solid facts and still decide to **** Andy off all day long. They also ignore the points I made at the start of the thread about this merely being a statistical comparison and nothing more. Utter idiots

Prime example of a plank. There are factual statistics there, but yet somehow I've 'made up bullshit' and somehow made these factual statistics 'look good'. ****ing idiot