I can think perfectly well for myself, than you very much. That's why I don't take one 'side' or the other, as they're all at it with their lies and sophisticated propaganda. What I object to is zealots of any 'side' ramming their beliefs down my throat as if it's God's truth, when there is a 99.9999999% chance that they are simply spouting pish that they've been fed, and failed to research its veracity or that of the opposite view. It's like religion - convert them somehow, then the rest is easy. They'll believe anything you say. We are being lied to by all sides and none of us will ever learn the truth in our lifetimes, if anyone ever will at any time. For every piece of 'evidence' any side presents, there is equal or more evidence presented to counter the argument. And so it will go on. It is naive to think you (or 'one', to be clear) are in possession of ALL the facts. That will never be the case. Ever. And finally, nope, not university. Glasgow College of Technology. Most of my education was in the Student Union drinking very cheap beer, hence I got chucked out after 1 year.
Apologies for my error, Glasgow college it was, But, student Unions are breeding grounds for left wing nut jobs with no grasp of the real world or reality, Not saying youre one though Without, obviously, doing your research, do you believe 99.9999999% Tommy Robinson to be Hitler reincarnate?
EU pensions get paid whether or not we leave, if they are paid in euros they’ll be worth more if the pound falls after leaving. If they have an EU pension it means they know a lot about how the EU works.
You could also do a chart of Leavers who are taking steps to move their businesses and/or themselves out of the UK after Brexit. This sort of false linkage really is poor.
Or a chart of remainers who have lived outside of the EU zone since before the referendum and continue to do so
A naive question but here goes. Did the leave voters want to leave because of immigration or was there another issue. I occasionaly read this thread and it generaly seems to be immigration that gets the most coverage, in one form or another.
Only a personal point of view. I don't think in the main it had a great deal to do with immigration. Yes people wanted control of immigration rather than the free for all under the EU. More to the point I think the vast majority of people were fed up of the EU spending our money. Also in my view the EU is not democratic. We could have got a reasonable exit deal if we did not have so many anti democratic MPs in our own country. All this has done is give support to the rest of the EU to resist our exit. How on earth you can support an organisation who has a drunken mouth piece like Junker is beyond me.
Appreciate the view it was all looking a bit like, we don't like foriegners but "no taxation without representation" I can understand
The remainders wanted to make it a racist thing all the population wanted was the ability for our country to make its own decisions.
The official leave campaign were very happy to allow the other Farage/Banks leave campaign to play on immigration concerns so that they could have a double bite of the cherry in that they remained respectable and could attract the people who would be turned off by Farage. Whilst Farage could play upon peoples fears on immigration to attract the voters worried about that (despite the fact that there are many stop guards in place so there need not be a 'free for all' for EU immigration - successive governments didn't implement them because of the economic benefits of immigration)
It’s a good question, unfortunately this subject tends to get to lowest common denominators pretty quickly. So leavers get called racists, remainders get called remoaners and the metropolitan elite and so on. A feature of the Leave vote is those voting Leave did not all vote for the same thing. Of people who I know personally very well, including my own family, I know one person for whom ‘too much immigration’ was pretty much her only concern (and she is definitely not a racist ). I know people who think we are wrapped up in red tape by the EU and would be better off economically without it. I know people who object to the EU as it takes away our national sovereignty and they consider it to be unelected and unaccountable. So there’s no one answer.
I've got to be honest and say ALL politicians leave me cold. I voted to leave. The U.K. Voted to leave so that should have been enough. If the UK had voted to remain I would have accepted it as the democratic will of the people. Only a personal view, but if we do remain I firmly believe that future generations will regret it, won't matter to me personally because I won't be here to say I told you so.
When I went to Rome with the wife, she wanted to visit the vatican city, we were told all women to have their shoulders covered, no strappy tops and knees covered. We did not question it or bat an eyelid, that was the rules for another country and we followed them, it was pretty much the same when we visited Egypt. What makes my blood boil is things like when we can't call a school play a nativity one, when foreign visitors start building moques and making demands of things they find offensive, you can walk into a bank or garage wearing a hijab but not a bikers helmet, passport applications, no scarfs or hats for British but muslim ones are okay, if that makes me racist I don't mind please log in to view this image
Actually quite a lot of people who want less immigration were objecting to Christian Poles etc, most Muslim immigrants come from outside the EU and we’ve had the control on those all along (which begs the question why have we not used it)? As I’m a child of the 1950’s working class Leeds, women wearing headscarves looks pretty normal to me. Can’t stand face covering though, seems unnecessary, actually a bit insulting to me (what am I going to do if I see their face, ravish them?) and most important, the human face is very expressive if you can’t see their expression you are missing a lot of communication.
The trouble is that the UK did vote to leave but a - it was a very close vote and b - the vote never specified how to leave. It was always the case that that would be in the hands of the government in charge and there are a great many ways to leave. And this government has f*cked up leaving royally. Democracy normally includes the ability to change your mind especially if they have not delivered what they promised. (and that's before we get to the electoral fraud). I agree that remaining by incompetence and stealth would be undemocratic but to be honest at present I don't see this government as it's so divided being able to deliver Brexit and at some point they will have to go back to the people.
The old adage When In Rome do as the Romans do. All guests in any country should follow the rules of that country. If they don't like the rules then don't go. Simples
