It's too hard to call I suppose because I/ we are trying to base points off of "What ifs?". But to put an example forward of why I'd be happy with "good" players if we can't get the "dream" ones: If we had one of Doucoure/ Kovacic/ Gomes this season, do you not think they'd have been better than a poor Dembele over the course of the campaign? If so, that could've been the fine margin between winning and losing the semi final (seeing as Dembele messed up for the first goal) and also potentially getting a few extra points in the Prem.
That's the thing, there's still plenty of deals nobody can see coming. For example a couple of years ago countless blogs and Twitter feeds believed that our sending a delegation to Germany was to sign a defensive midfielder, with Dortmund's Sven Bender the player being most heavily touted - and not one of them predicted we were headed to Leverkusen to sign Son.
Mousers getting work done early..... 'Liverpool have agreed a deal to sign Monaco midfielder Fabinho. The 24-year-old Brazilian is the proposed replacement for Emre Can, who is expected to confirm a free transfer move to Juventus. The fee is £39.3m guaranteed with a maximum of £4.4m in add-ons if the conditions of the deal are met.'
It's going to be embarrassing when Naby Keita shows up in July and it turns out that Norbert forgot he signed him...
Kavacic yes, and Gomes, quite possibly. But then again, for me, they would fall into your “dream” category, rather than “good”. What they would have brought to the team from being at Real and Barca (respectively), cannot be underestimated. This is why I think Lucas Moura will be fantastic next season. Coming from the best side in France with an abundance of top players around him everyday, only failing to get game time due to an abundance of quality in the squad. More players like that please. Funnily enough, Kovacic and Gomes are exactly that.
Fair enough, but are there any others within the last 5 years? He might be an exception, but nearly all other potential options have been shouted from the rooftops.
This I don't get. None of these players are regular starters for teams we have to compete with. We need to find other players who are better which means we will have to take risks.
I don't remember anyone predicting Firminho would be joining Saltypool a few years back, while Lorenzo Pellegrini joining Roma last summer was one of the few times one of those overly-elaborate introduction videos actually caught people by surprise That's the issue these days, with teams looking to put together one of those videos (which are getting ever-more obnoxious) or coining the perfect hashtag, there's more chance of the cat being let out of the bag.
Experience of winning and being around top players is good but it's not always a given that it makes them a great fit. Nando has a World Cup, European Championship, multiple Serie A's and a Europa League to his name but that done sod all for him - or the team - since joining. Fazio won trophies with Sevilla. Aurier won a **** load with PSG. Sometimes pure hunger from someone looking to prove themselves on a bigger stage can be just as beneficial as someone who's already experienced some of the glories of the game. I genuinely don't see Kovacic or Gomes being any better than Doucoure. Neither of those two have really proven themselves at these big clubs, Doucoure on the other hand has shown he can be a real handful for a very average side,makes you wonder what can he do when around genuine quality. FWIW I'd be very happy if any of them signed (if we can't get Seri/ Savic) but I'm just trying to point out that neither of those two are necessarily better than Doucoure just because they play for big clubs.
So who would you suggest that’s better and we could realistically sign than those 2 players that play at 2 of the best teams in Europe?
Nando is a terrible example though mate, as we signed him at the wrong time. Too old, too slow, not suited to our style. Total last minute panic buy. I agree about players with hunger, and that players who play for big clubs aren’t necessarily gonna work out, but you’d think there would be more chance of them doing so, bearing in mind the big club signed them in the first place? We are talking about Real and Barca here. Arguably 2 of the best, if not the two best. You could be right about Doucoure, and in the past I’d say let’s do it. But I’m trying to get out of that “he’ll do” mindset, and really asking myself who is going to make the difference we need so it’s not another season exactly like the last 3 or so.
I've not got a clue. I don't actually think its possible to identify excellent players for sure. That's why for every Dele there's an Nkoudou. Signing just good enough players is a waste of money. Llorente, Sissoko, Aurier are in that category as far as I can see. If there's some reason they are in the reserve team when they are better than those playing I think that might be a good signing. I hope Moura is in that category. At Man U I think Martial and Shaw might be. But look at Ozil and Sanchez. Real and Barcelona sold them for a reason. Players like that are very good but not good enough to improve us.
No one predicted Nando would've been this bad. No one. Unless I'm mistaken, there wasn't one Spurs fan who thought at the time of his signing that he'd be a bad buy for us though I'm happy to be corrected. I don't get why you're rating Doucoure off though as a "he'll do" type player yet seemingly deeming Gomes and Kovacic as players above that level. On a personal scale, taking away team success (which Gomes & Kovacic have barely contributed too), Doucoure's had a much better season than both of them combined. As I said, I'd personally take anyone of those (if Seri/ Savic can't be got) but I just fail to see how the other two have better credentials just for being bit part players at good sides when Doucoure has proven himself in a much inferior team, leading to the impression he can be even better if around better players/ manager/ facilities.
@redwhiteandermblue Any chance you'd be able to confirm or deny this? If true, it likely means to us.
Plenty of spurs fans were concerned over the signing mate. I bet if you could be arsed to go back to deadline day 2017 on here, you’d find a few at least. I’m sure I remember reading comments about people being concerned of his mobility and what he’d actually offer us. And twitter was full of people being less polite than us lot on here! Christ, it was perfect ammo for the “Levy out” gang to have a whinge! As for Doucoure, at the same time though, I don’t get what you see in him, that offers us improvement. It’s easier for a player to stand out in a Watford squad. At the start of the season I thought that Watford had struck gold with him and Richarlison, but they soon faded. Perhaps Kovacic and Gomes aren’t good enough, but I do wonder whether signing 1 or two players from the two best sides in the world and everything that comes with that, may be beneficial. They’ve been deemed good enough to be part of those squads, and Spanish teams have won the CL the last 12 years out of 18. Maybe this is the wrong approach, but I’m just trying to think outside the box as to who will give the squad something new, and something we’re missing. A winning mentality is definitely an attribute we lack, so perhaps some players struggling for game time at top clubs who literally win something every year, might be beneficial to us.
With Can moving to Juventus, there was talk of Sami Khedira moving to the premier league and he would tick a number of the boxes that we have for incoming players.
If the box is being one of our rivals non-starting players....we need to aim higher than this which means taking risks
