Holgate and Firmino incident !

The FA can also deal in probability rather than 'beyond reasonable doubt'.

 

I made a comment, went back in to edit it and it came out like that

 

Ah fair enough

 

Just listening to Roger Phillips and am surprised that nobody has phoned in about this? Are they too scared to talk about racism on there for fear of being seen as "defending racism"?

 

Roger is renowned for pulling anyone remotely defending racism to pieces, so maybe you're right.

 

Lets be honest as much I like Roger he is no Paxman is he?

 

Then the system needs a serious review. In order to give someone the power to pass judgement based on their personal perception of probability you would have to have absolute faith in their expertise and impartiality, and I think it's fair to say that there are serious doubts over the FA's display of those qualities.
It's ok when they are interpreting the rules of the game, but a subject such as racism has wider repercussions on society in general.
It needs a more stringent and impartial investigation than they are capable of imo, given their general performance on these matters.

 

But anyone that thinks an FA panel is in some way equal or better than the English justice system needs bringing up on a charge themselves.

 

He thinks he is, his "devil's advocate" approach only lasts until he loses his temper.

 

That probably wasn't a good word to describe it as it's not strictly probability and there's more to it than that but the principle is correct that they don't need beyond reasonable doubt... See Terry.

 

But they should do - it's too serious a social matter to be dealt with by amateurs.

 

Full stop ie please just end this.

 

Ffs.

Wish I had seen this first lol.

 

When you have seen the kind of fakery people can pull off that I have mate, that is not really an indication of anything.

I do understand the point, but.. what I say is still true.
The reality is he could not possibly have heard the word he claimed he heard because none of the words Firmino said even came close to it. Preto is Portuguese for black so even if Firmino did say it, Holgate would not have known he said it.

So what word would Holgate have thought was "******" or "negro" that Firmino said. Valid question? Or does he see racism everywhere?
A reaction doesn't evidence anything at all, especially his ham acting face reaction, which was imo well over the top for something he could not have possibly heard as it was never said.

 

Sorry mate. I made a comment, realised it wasn't 100% correct, went in to edit it and it came out as a full stop. I love your explanation though and I will keep that in mind for future use.

Like the next time Diego's on and we all comment with just a full stop

 

Ah, I thought you were ending the debate with your full stop Full stop

 

Ffs.

You are the last person I want agreeing with me lol.

That's it im going mad as well

 

IF Holgate had decided to 'play act' [for want of a better phrase] to get himself out of a booking then I agree, it's just as easy to fake a shocked look as it is to make a claim [false] that goes with it. He's never going to say he made it up is he and his evidence to the FA would follow this stance. Like you I know the Portuguese word for black/negro doesn't contain the letter 'n' or sound anything like what English speakers would call a racial slur.

Holgate could have banked on the offensive word sounding like it does in Spanish and tried to create a Suarez situation - like Suarez, Firmino too is South American but being Brazilian speaks a different language entirely. Holgate. like many others, may not be aware of this and chanced his luck. I too would say he made the claim 'in good faith' except for the fact that [presuming here because nobody's claimed he does] Holgate doesn't speak Portuguese and the 'n' word doesn't exist in that language so he couldn't possibly have misheard it.

 

giving the lad a bit of a benefit of the doubt like.. granted we've seen plenty of winkers and had all these kinds in the prem but the lad seems a bit thick so i doubt he's that fast thinking.

I agree that its not really possible from what we know was said to have got what holgate said he did. Unless theres an unseen angle to show other words. This is why i would have liked the full transcript to be published.


There is going to come a point where its got to be very clear.

I can call someone a smelly bastard or not
I can call them a son of a whore it seems no bother
I can't refer to where they are from
I can't refer to their colour
I cant refer to their religion

What else is going to be decided to be offensive next. parentage seems to be a free for all.... the Fa could have done firmino for foul and absuvie language but not for racial abuse i suppose so we should count ourselves lucky (in their minds)

 

****hound? ****pig?