Holgate and Firmino incident !

You have hit the nail right on the head!

The club needs to be consistent. On one hand we are condemning the despicable abuse heaped on one of our own. And on the other we can't be seen to brush off the possibility of a similar abuse FROM one of our players. It may well turn out that nothing has happened and Firmino is in the clear.

For those who equate the push from Holgate to a racist verbal retaliation, I say this. The push deserved a card, whether a yellow or red. But racist abuse is not acceptable even in the heat of the moment and several levels up higher than a push dangerous as it was.

 

there's enough there for fa unfortunately.

ran at him. had to be restrained by ref on its own is enough. add in language used (and don't give me excuses like evra and mourinho) the fa make up the rules to suit themselves in these cases.

I would not be shocked that they say they cannot prove what was said. give him a 3 or 4 game ban and in effect tar him with racism. the BBC and shearer have made sure of it already.

my view is we must have clarity. every single syllabel published and explained holgate just mistook puta for nxxxa. unless that's done firmino will be like John terry. forever a racist.

 

No one has said at anytime racial abuse is fine.

But when I mentioned about I deliberately go out to injure someone honest tackles gone wrong got brought into something that wasn't even mentioned!!

Again ffs.

Isn't one proven to have happened the other not?

Nothing what so ever to do with condoning one against our own and not the other.

 

I put that bit in. 3 matches for a red right. if it's honest. I said there should be more for nasty intention fouls to cause injury so we should separate

bad tackles from violent conduct from abusive language

 

This is true, unfair to criticise Holgate even if he misunderstood what Firmino was saying. The only time you could criticise him is if he made it up deliberately to distract from him pushing Firmino into the stands, which was a dangerous manoeuvre, which is unlikely in my mind. Also almost impossible to prove unless he admits it.

 

What if he did?

Where is everyone's moral high ground then lol

 

the best outcome for me is its proven firmino repeated the puta and that's what holgate mistook for a word beginning with n and ending with a.

if the fa statement is 3 game ban and unequivocal statement there was no racism I would take it now.

why? the fa are political animals and need to show the ref was a star here and players need to behave.

as I said I would be shocked if the perceived victim of mistaken racial abuse gets any punishment for his dangerous play

 

Lets be honest about the type of change we want, the people we want to change are those that will publicly say racist abuse is bad etc but then in private (or on internet) come with the same sort of nonsense as JOTL did earlier in thread. Change in culture is difficult and usually takes several generations to finally embed itself and so we have to do it right the sort of way eg If the Suarez incident had any influence it was mainly negative. to explain, people who genuinely believe racist insults are unacceptable (or hate LFC) had their views upheld so no change but for people with other views there was no sense of natural justice due to all the other factors involved, this was then exploited by right wing groups etc to further embed the "it's always the darkies playing on it'.

A feeling of equality and natural justice is huge in changing society and treating the verbal abuse more serious than physical assault does not feel like natural justice to most. lets take it out of football for an example, a thug runs down a street and physically assaults a passerby a member of public shouts and the thug to stop and the thug responds with fek off you .......tw@! Is it right that the punishment is more severe for the latter?

I would certainly like to see the end of racist abuse but i am not sure that virtue signaling to all those that already agree with those views is the right way to go about it.

 

Sorry but Holgate needs a red card suspension from the panel.

I could accept the ref just giving a yellow if nothing else happened due to his position etc. But the panel needs to set a punishment based on what they see. A player, after the ball has gone using deliberate excessive force that could result in serious injury to a player.

What Firmino did or said after is irrelevant to this action. Any offence he commits should be dealt with if not in isolation, separately.

We seriously can't go around saying you can physically assault people punishment free because that person was mean to you afterwards.

If there is no racist comment what firmino did warrants nothing more than a yellow. He doesn't strike anyone. He doesn't direct the language at the officials or crowd. So by today's ref standards it's a yellow.

Otherwise the likes of Rooney would be sent off every game....including this one. Oh and on a side note. Rooney needs to have a word with himself. From setting the thuggish tone at the start of match as example for young players like Holgate to be influenced to rushing to the ref yelling once again in this incident when he wasn't in the middle of it. He's supposed to be a senior player ffs! Act like you have more than 1 braincell.

 

Funny how the media haven’t used all six camera angles

 

Then he n that case every push should be punished with the same severity.

 

Are people really thinking Holgate went mental, accuses Firmino of calling him N**** to avoid a card? Maybe even a red. ?

 

Nope. Me pushing you from the front when I can see it coming and brace is a d8fferent world to a cowardly and aggressive push in the back meaning I have no way to expect it and brace.

Also the red card is for excessive or reckless force (check) that endangers the player or could have resulted in serious injury (check).

It's right there in the rules.

 

I'm certainly not

 

Are you trying to tell me footballers are intelligent?

They are overpaid tossers that in normal society get punished all the time from eye gouging to deliberately breaking someone's legs to assaults on dj's or its acceptable to shag your brothers wife.

Yet they get away with it.

 

Im not wrong...You have named one incident and thats against a copper...How many more incidents of racism against white people have you heard of?

Little or none would probably be the answer as its simply ignored most of the time yet you call a black person a ****** theres a national outcry...

Take the meat off the bone and brexit was mainly about getting "Immigrants" or "Them" (not all black) out of our country 52% of our country voted for that...
Most of the nation are racists in one way or another...
I dont condone calling racist names btw and no i didnt vote out either...

 

Its just almost impossible to prove that he would've lied about it, even if he did. Also, if we start saying that if there's no evidence of racial abuse you must be making it up then it would deter people from reporting it, which is counterproductive when it comes to battling racism.

 

That’s not the question, do you think Holgate made this accusation up in a split second to avoid a booking/being sent off?

 

bellend!

 

I don't know.

What makes you think he might not have done?