The thing is, in an ideal world, I would love for us to compete with a self funding model, but whilst the billionaire ownership model goes wrong for some, it will succeed for others, but what we can be sure of is that, when the championship is funded pretty much exclusively by billionaires and we still have little Norwich Delia, we won't stay in the championship. Will I support us in lge 1 or beyond, of course, but I want better than that and if that means stepping on board the billionaire gravy train then so be it. In a land of cheaters the honest club is sunk, do we want to be the last honest club? The rules are set up so to be easy to flout. Until that changes we need some more wedge. Bah!
Just read about the Chinese take over of Barnsley!! Yet another "Small Town" club that will have Millions for us to compete against!
Ok I'm going to bite here Dave and give my honest answer to this. Tradition is great up to a point but there comes a time when there is a real need to re-invent, re-brand call it what you will to move forward. If our football club continues in the same vein we will gradually slip down the pecking order with little or no chance of ever returning to the top table in my opinion. Ok there are those like you, Gandy and RBF who wouldn't want this and are happy with the 'little Norwich' tag (no offence), then there are others who like me would welcome real investment from whoever providing they had the best interests of the club at heart, be it a Russian, Chinaman, American or whoever. I have supported City since 1971 when my dear old Dad first took me to Carrow Road and have seen many ups and downs in that time. In my youth City were an established top flight side spending just three seasons in the second tier betrween 1972 and 1995 - 23 YEARS ! I therefore struggle to accept that because we spent so many seasons in the lower divisions in the monochrome years our true level is where we are now. We must be thankful to our current owners for what they have done for the club (yes I really did type that!), but they are now holding us back with their naive and blinkered vision, notwithstanding the upteen mistakes made during their tenure which are too many to list here. If as seems likely they remain stubborn until the end and refuse to actively seek real investment from either these shores or abroad, direct action by the fans in the form of protests before and after the games a la the 'Chase' era will unfortunately be the only option to force them out. I truly hope that it doesn't come to this, but mark my words if things carry on the way they are for much longer with little or no success on the pitch, it WILL happen believe me. On a lighter note and refering back to my comment of re-branding I would like to see the following long term: A move to a new purpose built stadium on the outskirts of the City. The Costessey Showground would be perfect with it's easy access from the A11 and A47 respectively and room for plenty of parking for both Public and Private transport. A change of strip to a classy all white affair with a subtle yellow and green trim recognising our history. A new club crest to replace the extremely dated one we have now and not necessarily bearing a Canary. A return to our original nickname of 'the Citizens' I am now off to don my tin hat as I await dog's abuse for my suggestions
I am well aware of your wishes Rich, I would hate us to lose our yellow and green and I'm sure Man. City fans would object to us being called the Citizens
I think what Dave said about someone having to come bottom of the league despite having mega rich owners was quite pertinent. Also, the same clubs as now would always have heavier investment, so it's back to square one. Plus, we'd have sold our soul. Rue the day we start paying hundreds of millions for unlikeable prima donnas just to try to keep up. I understand KIO's viewpoint, really I do, but it's not for me.
Ok I'm going to bite here Dave and give my honest answer to this. Tradition is great up to a point but there comes a time when there is a real need to re-invent, re-brand call it what you will to move forward. If our football club continues in the same vein we will gradually slip down the pecking order with little or no chance of ever returning to the top table in my opinion. Totally agree, tradition is fine but not if it stands in the way of any prospect of progress Ok there are those like you, Gandy and RBF who wouldn't want this and are happy with the 'little Norwich' tag (no offence), then there are others who like me would welcome real investment from whoever providing they had the best interests of the club at heart, be it a Russian, Chinaman, American or whoever. In an ideal world all clubs would be self funding and there would be a more level playing field, that world doesn't exist so lets go find ourselves someone who can help us compete I have supported City since 1971 when my dear old Dad first took me to Carrow Road and have seen many ups and downs in that time. In my youth City were an established top flight side spending just three seasons in the second tier betrween 1972 and 1995 - 23 YEARS ! I therefore struggle to accept that because we spent so many seasons in the lower divisions in the monochrome years our true level is where we are now. You old bastard! I wasn't even born then. None the less I grow up with a top tier City and whilst I don't see it as some god given right that we should be top tier, I don't buy the notion that we are or should be a second tier side and be happy with that as our lot. We must be thankful to our current owners for what they have done for the club (yes I really did type that!), Who are you and what have you done to the real KIO? but they are now holding us back with their naive and blinkered vision, notwithstanding the upteen mistakes made during their tenure which are too many to list here. In general I would agree with you but, I honestly think we have this one last chance to turn the club around under this ownership model. If we can get a functioning academy producing players capable of playing in the PL, if we can pick up gems from abroad to suppliment that and find managers capable of moulding teams better than the some of their parts, get back to the PL and you really can self sustain if managed well at DoF and Coach level. The trouble is in the next couple of years we will fall further before we can move forward and with each fall the rise required gets bigger. Realistically all my hopes under D&M now rest on Webber, if he goes then they must to. If as seems likely they remain stubborn until the end and refuse to actively seek real investment from either these shores or abroad, direct action by the fans in the form of protests before and after the games a la the 'Chase' era will unfortunately be the only option to force them out. Unfortunately you're right, they won't ever chose to leave, so if the fans want them out then that is the only course of action, because the shareholders seem utterly cowed and oblivious to the owners shortcomings. Some might argue that having saved the club she should get greater loyalty and respect, but fleecing the fans with amoungst the highest prices in the championship (Middling for the PL) and not looking out for investment that may enhance the clubs standing, she is being neither loyal or respectful to the fans. I truly hope that it doesn't come to this, but mark my words if things carry on the way they are for much longer with little or no success on the pitch, it WILL happen believe me. I think most are like me and currently there is little appetite for protesting, I think the Webberlution needs at least the next full season to have had any chance of baring fruit, however if we haven't at least flirted strongly with the playoffs next season and we have sold all of our remaining family jewels then I think things could boil over. Now Whittakers gone, Martin is no where near the team, we need a hate figure and poor ole Delia might well be it. On a lighter note and refering back to my comment of re-branding I would like to see the following long term: A move to a new purpose built stadium on the outskirts of the City. The Costessey Showground would be perfect with it's easy access from the A11 and A47 respectively and room for plenty of parking for both Public and Private transport. I've always hated the idea of leaving CR, not for sentiment, but when I go I like to walk to the ground via a couple of pubs, likewise on the way home. No soulless new bar/pub by a new ground will compare to the options in the city, couple that with a stadium by numbers that would likely look the carbon copy of; Derby, Leicester etc etc no I would like to see a redevelopment of the city stand to get us inxs of 32000 and I don't think we need much more, not for the forseeable. The way things are going we might want to shelve any thoughts of increased capacity. A change of strip to a classy all white affair with a subtle yellow and green trim recognising our history. Whilst I wouldn't be screaming blue murder if the kit colour were to change I wouldn't be a fan of any change, yellow is at least a little different, whilst I would almost never go for yellow clothing beyond our replica shirts, I'd not be keen on being just another red/blue/white A new club crest to replace the extremely dated one we have now and not necessarily bearing a Canary. Not in a hurry for this but again I could live with it if done well and not wholey for commercial reasons, I'd not be keen if we had crossed redbulls, not unless they gave us a truely obscene ammount of money A return to our original nickname of 'the Citizens' You hanker for the future and complain at the dated crest and then you want an old nickname? again, I have no desire to not be the canaries, with that said we have no great remaining mining activity so what should we call ourselves in the future? Farmers? Crop scientists, Insurers, wind farmers? I am now off to don my tin hat as I await dog's abuse for my suggestions Interesting rather than worthy of abuse, football is not unusual in that it attracts a lot of traditionalists who are averse to change, I guess it is an identity and you don't want people changing your identity, not unless its on your terms. Bah!
I agree with all of KIO's points other than the change of shirt colours badge and bulldozing Carrow rd. Being so close to the station makes it a great day out for visiting fans and yellows that don't live in Norwich. Walking through the riverside and grabbing lunch and a pint is very easy and creates local revenue . If I had to get a train then a bus to the outskirts of the city I would not be able to get the last Liverpool st train back for evening games. I like our stadium and it would be better to extend than crush it and build an Asda there .
Just been reading through the debate after KIO's post from this morning and firstly - I'm impressed that all the posts after have been sensible and reasoned. I can agree with much of what you say KIO, apart from the move to somewhere near the Showground - the only pub near there is the 'soulless' Premier Inn - also called the Showground!! I guess the trouble is, that any new owners are most likely going to want to move and sell CR for a quick influx of cash.
