This is a hard one in today's world The denial.of the Holocaust is not the same as questioning some of the stuff around it. It's like domestic violence and femenism to disagree or question is taken as advocating regular beatings for women I have done some stuff on the holocaust in the past and I have to say that although I don't deny persecution of the jews I seriously doubt the 6million figure. TO BE CLEAR it could be more as well as less but the actual 6m has been used by Zionists from way before WW2. To be further clear the Holocaust museum agree with me but don't allow anyone to question it. They, or their chief execs at times, and other prominent Jewish scholars have said it was less
Indeed Fan, it is an unsavoury topic but as you say the 6 million figure has been banded about since 1910-20's-30's to the present day and as these were repoted in National newspapers they cannot be discounted as insane anti semite ramblings.
This was my point earlier mate, basically there is enough evidence to show certain things now but its seen as "being a ****" to even discuss it. Reason I included domestic violence in the mix, may have been bizarre, was because it is now proven that women are actually not the biggest victim of DV. Men are. The problem is a punch from a woman is laughed off but even a slap from a bloke will a)potentially do more damage or b) women will take it further ie call police Even in the cases where women are beaten its something like 70% instigated by the woman. Now you may rightly say no excuse but imagine this real life scenario Bloke is watching footie on tele, woman walks in and turns of over. Bloke says he was watching that. She says I always watch EastEnders omnibus. He says watch it upstairs. She says no its b&w tele. He says OK I will watch footie upstairs. She says no that is tv is mine I bought it. He says I bought this one but am happy to compromise here. She says no. He then puts footie on and says stop being childish. She turns tele off. He puts it on and so on. So she slaps him, he doesn't respond and says you need to stop. She picks up a mug and wacks him with it. He still says wtf and tells her stop being silly. She unplugs tele, rips out cord and swings at him with the wire catching him in the head with the plug. Must of hurt cos now he lashes out, catches her on the cheek and she starts screaming abuse.
It is ****ish to discuss it, the exact numbers are irrelevant and the focus on them is merely to somehow try and decry the holocaust imo. It's the preserve of ****s. As for domestic violence it is a two way street, but I'm not sure I agree with your stats.
I disagree and have always said the stance that its off limits is wrong. I think the figure if 6m is very relevant in global politics and puts to bed the arguments used today in Israel by Zionists. Orthodox Jews have never had an issue with it and its a classic case of a minority dictating the rules. The whole "to discuss is to devalue" etc is bullshit IMO. No topic is off limits if its done sensibly. The figs for DV are through my work with victim support from a few years back so may be out of date but the principle is correct. Incidentally the worst perpetrators of spousal abuse are police officers bit you won't find that stat anywhere
If you can't understand that the difference between 4m and 6m is irrelevant in the context of the holocaust then you're a weird ****, probably with an agenda.
With an agenda Did you miss the bit about it being may be more? The 6m was an agenda but like I said its hard to have a sensible discussion on the topic without labels.
Exactly Fan, if the topic is discussed in the correct manner it in itself is not an atrocity as some would believe. My own personal take is the holocaust did happen but I wanted to explore what others were thinking and to try to understand the mindset of the people.
Some people will take a rabid “never fcuking discuss that topic with me” irrational thick-as-pig-**** attitude over some topics. I never subscribe to that view. Talking is better than killing. No matter how tough the subject. I do agree with Tobias to the extent that it is a meaningless argument whether it 4 or 6 million Jews murdered by the Nazis. Even if it was only 1 million, it doesn’t make it any better that it was only 1 million murdered and not more. By the same token, it isn’t right that Zionists attempt to make political gain by inflating the figures, which is why I see no harm in discussing the numbers. There is a World of difference between trying to debate the actual number murdered, and attempting to argue that it never happened.
Huge difference between denial and discussion IMO but you wouldn't think so the way these discussions go And tbf its not just this topic. I have views that differ with the mainstream about martin Luther kung Jnr , ghandi, the whole wahabbi islam issue etc too They are based on my own research etc and sure could be wrong, may be wrong but I wont know if I can't voice them and get told
My argument isnt about it being less or inflating figures. Its how certain statements have been used for an agenda in world politics affecting things today Research the 6m figure and you will see newspaper reports from way back for that figure in Russia etc. Now I may be full of **** but how many know that and its significance?
