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Off Topic Paradise Papers - offshore tax avoidance

Discussion in 'Hull City' started by dennisboothstash, Nov 5, 2017.

  1. Chazz Rheinhold

    Chazz Rheinhold Well-Known Member

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    ‘Anyone may arrange his affairs so that his taxes shall be as low as possible; he is not bound to choose that pattern which best pays the Treasury. There is not even a patriotic duty to increase one’s taxes .  .  . nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands.’
    Learned Hand.
     
    #121
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  2. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    Flush it?...I wouldn’t even trust him to sit on it the right way round!
     
    #122
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  3. howdentiger

    howdentiger Well-Known Member

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    Exactly :)
     
    #123
  4. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    American nonsense from a Judge who was showboating and yet still ruled that if the act was purely to avoid tax then it wasn’t correct
     
    #124
  5. howdentiger

    howdentiger Well-Known Member

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    In a way I agree with income tax laws in some USA states....florida for example no income tax but replaced with sales tax, use tax, property tax and corporate tax
     
    #125
  6. Amin Arrears

    Amin Arrears Well-Known Member

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    We are the 5th biggest economy in the world. If we can't afford to fund our services, is not because of a tiny percentage of people dodging some of their taxes.
     
    #126
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  7. Amin Arrears

    Amin Arrears Well-Known Member

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    He didn't 'get' £3.3m, he just didn't pay it. They chose to use the Isle of Man to set up the company in, it could have been anywhere. If he chose to do it in Chad nobody would give a flying ****.
     
    #127
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  8. Amin Arrears

    Amin Arrears Well-Known Member

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    How many people moaning on here have bought something on amazon because it was cheaper? Or been paid cash for whatever and not declared it? That includes petrol money someone gave you for a lift. How many of you have contracts with BT, EE, Vodafone, Eon because they're cheaper? Why do you think you're saving money from these, and other services?
     
    #128
  9. tigerscanada

    tigerscanada Well-Known Member

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    Up the Swanny...

     
    #129
  10. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    Apple’s way of doing it
    As has been said the only real way to resolve this would be either through every country having the same tax laws...or by people choosing to not use companies that do this
    Neither is likely, but this could be the start of something bigger maybe

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41889787
     
    #130

  11. Amin Arrears

    Amin Arrears Well-Known Member

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    And would you look at that. Ireland doesn't want to collect the tax it's owed.
     
    #131
  12. originallambrettaman

    originallambrettaman Mod Moderator
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    The most startling thing to me in the report, is how few Neymar's you'd get with all that money...
     
    #132
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  13. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    Just to put the quantities of cash involved in context, using previous government estimates, even before these leaks

    Benefit fraud - £1.2b (DWP)
    Benefits accidentally overpaid by government error - £1.4b (DWP)
    Benefits unclaimed - £16b (HMRC)
    Tax avoided or evaded - £30b (HMRC)*

    *other estimates suggested this was actually £120b prior to the paradise papers being leaked
     
    #133
  14. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    I think the super rich use Neymars as currency so they don’t have to use such big figures on spreadsheets!
     
    #134
  15. Fez

    Fez Well-Known Member

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    There is only so long you can discuss this (it seems to be in a loop now) before we bump into those ****ing big elephants - how the taxes are raised and how they are spent. Politics is then inevitable.

    I believe that the emphasis on greed being a natural driver is overstated and does overlook the many good qualities in the high earner population.
     
    #135
  16. originallambrettaman

    originallambrettaman Mod Moderator
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    The government estimate of £34b for unpaid taxes includes loads of things, not just tax avoidance and evasion, which they actually estimate to be £7.1b.

    https://fullfact.org/economy/tax-avoidance-evasion-uk/
     
    #136
  17. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    Lazy quoting from me, the figures I was reading did actually say ‘not collected’ too
    Although ‘not collected’ also includes plenty of illegal or unethical activities too
    Either way the amount avoided/evaded is much bigger than the amount lost in benefit fraud
     
    #137
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  18. Obadiah

    Obadiah Well-Known Member

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    Anyone can change the world if they want to.
     
    #138
  19. Chazz Rheinhold

    Chazz Rheinhold Well-Known Member

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    Yes. So it's up to the government of the day to sort it out.
     
    #139
  20. dennisboothstash

    dennisboothstash Well-Known Member

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    Governments I’d agree, but this issue is bigger than one government alone.
     
    #140
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