1. Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

?

Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    30,818
    Likes Received:
    28,823
    In this case though he’s probably right. Though wood is renewable unlike coal, burning it still releases co2 etc and with the air quality in London anything that can make it better should be considered. I was in central London on Sunday and was horrified by the grime that I acquired simply by walking around.
     
    #13161
    QPR Oslo likes this.
  2. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    3,337
    Likes Received:
    870
    Burning anything organic releases CO2. By taking the measures he suggests, all he's doing is moving the large scale problem (that of energy generation) elsewhere. There's no way that even if every house in London had a wood-burning stove the cumulative effect would be a major factor to London's grime. London has always been a dirty city (with a few exceptions here and there) and all the efforts so far (congestion charging, low emission zone, this) have been ineffective.

    Not sure what the solution would be, because quite simply when you get nearly 9 million people living in a small area (current greater London density is 14,500 per square mile) they produce dirt. Add the millions more that commute into the city every day for work or pleasure, and I don't see it's a problem that will be impacted one iota by telling people they can't have a wood stove.
     
    #13162
  3. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Messages:
    24,488
    Likes Received:
    23,924
    No new dog yet, but Mrs Stroller has moved from 'never again' to watching the Paul O'Grady programme with renewed interest. The problem is, we both like big dogs (we had a Bernese before the Newfoundland), but they just don't last very long. We do miss the walks in the woods, though, so I think there will be a replacement quite soon.
     
    #13163
    sb_73 likes this.
  4. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    69,549
    Likes Received:
    57,007
    I got a new puppy yesterday. Efforts to call him Sir Les were denied.
     
    #13164
    sb_73 likes this.
  5. Stroller

    Stroller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Messages:
    24,488
    Likes Received:
    23,924
    What make?
     
    #13165
  6. Star of David Bardsley

    Star of David Bardsley 2023 Funniest Poster

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    69,549
    Likes Received:
    57,007
    Chihuahua crossed with Japanese Chin.

    Named Pablo (after Pablo Escobar).
     
    #13166
    sb_73 and Stroller like this.

  7. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    30,818
    Likes Received:
    28,823
    Naming rights are important. I was bullied over a six month period by my wife and daughter to get a dog at all and eventually relented on condition I did the naming and had no role in caring for him. I was very keen on ‘Jesus Christ’ (though now think ‘Allah’ would be even better) but eventually settled on Stan. Which suits him perfectly. And of course I do 90% of the dog walking, playing feeding etc. And wouldn’t have it any other way.
     
    #13167
  8. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    30,818
    Likes Received:
    28,823
    Wood burning stoves contribute between 25 and 35% of fine particle pollution in London, apparently. Fine particle pollution is the stuff that causes 9,500 early deaths in London a year, and 40,000 across the country.

    The long term solution is to convert everyone’s central heating and hobs to electric and generate the electricity through solar, wind, tidal power. Expensive, complicated etc etc, but we will be entitled to feel very smug indeed if we do this.
     
    #13168
    QPR Oslo likes this.
  9. QPR Oslo

    QPR Oslo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,686
    Likes Received:
    6,756
    Try taking a trip to Norway and walk around outside in one of the small areas in the mountains packed with occupied winter cabins at a weekend. The stench and feel of the burning wood fumes in your lungs will cure you of any idea of cosy wood fires being good for anyone''s health.
     
    #13169
  10. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    3,337
    Likes Received:
    870
    I assume that's the only - and therefore prevalent - pollutant there?
     
    #13170
  11. GoldhawkRoad

    GoldhawkRoad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2011
    Messages:
    9,739
    Likes Received:
    3,387
    Diesel and log-burning stoves - de rigeur 15 years ago and now regarded with horror.

    I have the latter and use it a bit (I have a lot of logs here in West Sussex). There aren't enough houses nearby for it to be a localised problem and the smell of sweet apple wood in the air is part of winter for me. Everything in moderation - next year, they'll discover house solar panels give inmates skin cancer
     
    #13171
    ELLERS and rangercol like this.
  12. QPR Oslo

    QPR Oslo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2011
    Messages:
    21,686
    Likes Received:
    6,756
    In these small "villages" in the mountains where most of the cabins are holiday homes and empty most of the time, it is,. Other than when people arrive and leave in their vehicle of choice, increasingly electric run now. But you can smell the difference between wood smoke and diesel fumes pretty clearly in Oslo for example.
     
    #13172
  13. sb_73

    sb_73 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2012
    Messages:
    30,818
    Likes Received:
    28,823
    Now here’s a cracking nugget of info.

    Britain’s exports have grown since the referendum, largely attributed to the fall in £.

    Over the last five years our largest physical export has been cars, but for the last year that has been overtaken by gold. It’s not our gold of course it’s gold stored here by central banks and other foreign investors.

    For some reason the movement of gold is included in the trade figures (it really shouldn’t be). In times of uncertainty - Brexit referendum, Trump election etc - gold moves around more. It’s 9% of our trade even though it’s not ours to trade.

    The result is that all the trade figures we are quoted are misleading. We are not quite the great trading nation we are claimed to be, we are nearly 10% smaller. We have been repeatedly told in the referendum campaign and after that the EU takes 46% and falling of our exports, so the rest of the world is more important to us. But if you strip gold out of the equation (most of it is sent to China, India and Switzerland), the EU is taking 50% of our real exports. It’s share has fallen, and the diffference might be small in % terms, but 50% has a psychological resonance missing from 46%. And the growth in exports boasted about recently is slightly less impressive.

    I don’t think anybody set out to deliberately deceive with use of these statistics, it’s the way that the statistics are put together that is misleading.
     
    #13173
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2017
  14. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    3,337
    Likes Received:
    870
    A larger slice of a smaller pie is often less pie...
     
    #13174
  15. Lawrence Jacoby

    Lawrence Jacoby Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,431
    Likes Received:
    949
    In France there is talk of banning log burners ... good luck with that

    EDF won a court ruling to install more wind turbines in the national park where i live which was a outrage ... They want everyone on electric

    So when they erected six recently two were instantly dynamited by locals ... love it

    EDF have even purchased my commune's water turbine and will attempt to shut it down later

    The difference is people do not stand for things which aren't right

    I have just had 3 steer of logs delivered in case i need them ... 3/4 metre long as i have a monster log burner ... 30 months matured 140 euros try finding that price in the UK. I have friends all have log burners in the UK so it is getting out of hand no doubt and the price of logs is now climbing. This pollution angle IMO is daft and the UK allowed the log burning industry to grow so i blame them anyway
     
    #13175
    GoldhawkRoad likes this.
  16. West London Willy

    West London Willy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    3,337
    Likes Received:
    870
    please log in to view this image
     
    #13176
  17. ELLERS

    ELLERS Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2011
    Messages:
    22,785
    Likes Received:
    11,186
    I am quite lucky as I? I normally get my logs for free a I let the farmer use my barn and in return he drops off the logs.
     
    #13177
    Lawrence Jacoby likes this.
  18. Lawrence Jacoby

    Lawrence Jacoby Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,431
    Likes Received:
    949
    Yep very hard to imagine that trade in the U.K. chances are they would be nicked. I also allow my neighbour to use one of outbuildings for the same purpose as he collects throughout the year plus introduces a log burning science to the act of house warming ... he burns different woods on different days/times to remain healthy example he has eucalyptus and rose woods if he feels a cold coming on. Plus he thinks I am mad paying money for wood
     
    #13178
  19. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

    Joined:
    May 11, 2011
    Messages:
    115,905
    Likes Received:
    231,911
    Spain threatens to break up the euro unless Catalonia comes to heel
    28 September 2017 • 10:01pm

    please log in to view this image

    The Catalan 'Diada' taps into deep historical loyalties, not least the raw legacy of the civil war
    While the EU watches in disbelief, a remote threat has mushroomed suddenly into an existential crisis. It is even more intractable than Brexit, and certainly more dangerous.
    The volcanic events unfolding by the day in Catalonia threaten the EU project within its core. They pose a direct threat to the integrity of monetary union.
    Former French premier Manuel Valls – son of a celebrated Catalan painter – warns that if this weekend’s banned vote on independence goes ahead and leads to Catalan secession, it will be “the end of Europe” as a meaningful mission.

    no idea what the rest says as i dont subscribe
     
    #13179
  20. Lawrence Jacoby

    Lawrence Jacoby Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,431
    Likes Received:
    949
    The area I live in still considered itself Catalan and it hasn’t helped that the new region of Occtaine is headed from Toulouse ... the locals around me claim they are not Mediterranean people plus they also hate the Spanish lots of divisions that the U.K. is not aware of or doesn’t what to which is the way of everyone nowadays

    Said before the irony could be the U.K. leaves paying full price economically and culturally only to see Europe change anyway
     
    #13180
    kiwiqpr and QPR Oslo like this.

Share This Page