As much as I'd like to point the finger at The Fail and Express on this one, they've only been part of it. I've seen stuff about him right across the print media and documentaries on the BBC and Channel 4, too. The Americans ran with him for a bit and he's done stuff for RT and the like, as well. He basically pimped himself out as the face of British Islamic fundamentalism for several years. He was almost the other side of the coin to Tommy Robinson. I don't think that either represent who and what they claim to, honestly.
All wumming aside for a second likes of choudary need to be engaged in conversation other than where it's a free for all. The stuff said needs to be countered not with name calling and what happens in that vid you posted earlier but systematically countered point by point Or no coverage at all What has happened makes him look like an anarchist to some
The normal ones do....but obviously it's not loud enough. Very hard to find these people because they work on the sly. Normal as **** on a day to day basis. Only thing we can do is to say something if we see it or hear some odd ideologies. However these people do not preach in mosques or hand leaflets at the door. They blend...do psychological breakdowns on potential recruits then probably approach them on a one to one basis. That lad who blew himself up a year or so ago, who was from Huddersfield. His 'ol man is a Bus driver, mates with my brother. I'd probably walked past him and been to the same Mosque. You just don't know....they don't do their business in front of the likes of me.
People like Choudray don't seem very interested in any rational conversation. Only the one about how soon Shariah law can be introduced into the UK. And that could register as one of the shortest conversations in history!...
Doesn't have to be him, just used his example as he was being discussed And tbh at the risk of getting called a sympathiser I honestly did meet him many years ago to have that conversation and it wasn't as you describe. To put it in context I do that or did that in my younger days with may folk ranging from choudary to dawkins.
He was endlessly engaged in conversation. He had no interest in it. I've seen him do loads of interviews, have discussions over time, have his points challenged and been allowed to talk freely. He treats it all as an opportunity to preach. It's still important to do it, to some extent, as it's about trying to reach his potential supporters. He was given far too much credence and profile, though. It allowed him to use his publicity and spread his views to a wider audience. The police investigations into him will probably make interesting reading, if they ever become available.
Everything I know or have heard about him says he's an extremist. An apparent religious extremist. Extremists, as the name suggests, exist on the edges of their chosen doctrine. Their views, or rather twisted interpretations of their particular faith or ideology, brook no opposition. Their's is a black and white view of things. You either see things their way or you're the enemy.
From what I know a lot of the interviews are done specifically to get one upmanship and that isn't the conversation that's needed. I doubt all stuff around them will get released simply due to who they were years back. What I mean here is that likes of Abu hamza were given awards for their work at Finsbury park mosque and kids taken their for school day trips Similarly in yne early days of hizb ut tahrir the reason likes of majid nawaz were attracted was because govts sort of supported them and they got to go preach in Pakistan (IBM abubizzadeen etc) to garner army support for a caliphate of sorts This history is conveniently forgotten now same as MCB who were given millions by Blair but now are anti givtbas funding was withdrawn Basically its a mess or in the words of that movie a clusterfuck
This ^ sums up the problem of how you stop the spread of this indoctrination imo, and unfortunately highlights why internet surveillance is key to how the security forces gain some of their intelligence in the battle against it.
You could well be right but it's worth a try. We need to get away from bezzie mate to extremist with no in between
The problem with that is that like the snoopers thing a while back councils used it to spy on people claiming disability but it never stopped attacks Even last nights came out of nowhere it seems Or in the case of the London bridge attack all the signs were there and ignored As hard as it may seem we need to discuss things like khilafah openly and honestly without fear that the very mention of the word say by me will attract unwanted attention, unless its preaching the wrong stuff obviously
I don't know what else people are suppose to say or do... Hope you don't mean every time these twats carry out these attacks the muslims are suppose to come and be apologetic about to all, that's like saying non-muslims should come out and say not in my name every time West destabilise a country, help create these fringe groups for their own ends in the name of democracy. btw infidel was a term created by the crusaders... I despise the fact that instead of understanding the both sides are creating a rift in the normal every day people....
I've visited many countries and have without fail respected the prevailing faith that exists there ... there is a poisonous arrogance in thinking that your faith, whatever it might be, has precedence over another... Don't like the prevailing faith in the country where you live? ... then find one where you do ... Simples
If necessary, yes!! Why not!??? These people are using, or hiding behind your faith! If you don't support them, don't support their beliefs and aims, then say so! Say it loud and clear. Because until every decent Muslim unites to drive these extremists away from the cover they're using, you will all be tarred with the same brush in the minds of many. All that is necessary for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing!
I can't remember if it was yourself that claimed Islamic extremist and thats when I said there is no basis for this in islam, as they are not the first to come up with the suicide bombing idea. You mentioned no other militias do this, which wasn't the case Tamil Tiger perfected the suicide bombing and these lot took it up from there... They are using the virgin thing as well other concept and revenge as the basis for recruitment probably but factually it has no basis in Islam. This is very similar to idea of using democracy as the reason to wage war, no different in my view and many others.
Likewise ...took my youngest to her first concert just after the Bataclan ...Imagine Dragons in Birmingham...she was 11 at the time and I was on my guard all night ... thankfully everything OK but did consider not going ...then thought 'fcuk them' that's what the bastards want ...
Your argument would be valid if people didn't. Just look at the news live from Manchester. However I would never apologise for what happened today simply it has nothing to do with me in terms of the perpetrator. I will sympathise with my fellow victims as we are all victims I will stand and fight an enemy or tyrant or oppressor with anyone regardless of colour religion etc but these terrorists are as much me as Hitler was you
That would be like me saying, you need to come out every time a country is destroyed in the name of democracy, same as I and others are not responsible for their actions, you are not responsible for the governments/greedy corps actions.
