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Off Topic The Goodhand Arms

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by TheSecondStain, Jul 15, 2014.

  1. VocalMinority

    VocalMinority Well-Known Member

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    Also i don't remember Flint ever
    getting around to drawing up a map which is kind of important for the book!
     
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  2. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    True!
     
    #31222
  3. TheSecondStain

    TheSecondStain Needs an early night

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    RL Stevenson would often get maps and illustrations put in his novels [for example, Kidnapped has the whole journey of David Balfour mapped out] so it's quite possible that someone could get a route sorted.

    Quite looking forward to the rest of Black Sails now.

    Btw, I watched Mutiny. Pretty good. I very, very vaguely know Conrad, in that a friend of a friend knows him, and I must admit that I was sympathetic with him on the rowing bit, just a little. Only I would have done 3 or 4 hour turn a rounds at night. I think he was talking about rowing for 4-5 hours through the day. No way.
    That Chris was always going to be a problem, but I kind of hoped that he would knuckle down with more responsibility, there being one bloke less after the carpenter left. But he couldn't hack just being one of the grunts when he had so much modern sailing experience. Horses for courses. I'm sure he could be a perfectly reasonable sailing instructor. Just not a team member in a pressure situation.
     
    #31223
  4. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    Bligh has never got credit for a fantastic feat of navigation. Most of the mutineers ended up killing each other....yet they get all the attention now, whereas Bligh lost only one of his men. And there were others left on the Bounty who wanted to go with Bligh, but couldn't fit on the boat...which suggests he had more of their respect than suggested by various movies.
     
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  5. Whiteley Saint

    Whiteley Saint Well-Known Member

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    #31225
  6. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    #31226

  7. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    I read that as well...I hope his experience can help others with PTSD and related problems.
     
    #31227
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  8. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint What a disgrace Forum Moderator

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    Glad you enjoyed Mutiny TSS. I think Ant the skipper was right about the rowing having thought about it. Even at night any exercise would have meant consuming more water than they had, or pushing their dehydration to a life-threatening extent. As it turned out, the ocean currents took them to Timor without the wind, but they wouldn't have managed without the extra water from the support boat.

    Chris made me so annoyed, such a disruptive influence. I do suspect that the producers, knowing it was going to air on Channel 4, included someone like him deliberately, to create more tension between the crew a la reality TV. If so, they shouldn't have bothered, the men had enough to worry about without a rogue male like him. One thing I was very impressed with was the complete lack of any kind of hostility or tension over the fact that the ship's doctor was gay, among a fairly testosterone-laden bunch of blokes.

    As for William Bligh, the point was made during the series that the image we have of him as a strict martinet was a Hollywood invention. He was actually a very engaging personality, as well as a remarkable seaman, who fell out with some of his crew on the Bounty mainly because the men didn't want to leave the women they had taken up with on Tahiti, where they had stayed for over a year.
     
    #31228
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  9. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    One of the most powerful things he said was that the (US) army teaches them how to put on and wear the uniform, but not how to take it off. So true. I can't imagine what it would be like to come back from all he has been though.
     
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  10. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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  11. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    #31231
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  12. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    A dog is the only love you can buy. Haven't got a dog now because they are a tie as I believe they shouldn't be left alone too much, but they are special.
     
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  13. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Cat's love you as well .
     
    #31233
  14. fran-MLs little camera

    fran-MLs little camera Well-Known Member

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    A recent study showed that, although not as marked as a dog's response, a cat's oxytocin levels rise when near their owner showing they care. And most cats react more to their owner than to food....now that is amazing. :)
     
    #31234
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  15. Saint Helen

    Saint Helen Well-Known Member

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    I can well believe that. My Poppy does sometimes leave her food to come and have a cuddle <hug> Just because cats are more discerning than dogs, it doesn't mean that they don't love their owners just as much :emoticon-0109-kiss:
     
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  16. TheSecondStain

    TheSecondStain Needs an early night

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    The rowing at night, well may be it could have raised morale, but they could always have stopped. I'm a bit pro-active like Conrad.

    Yes, I too thought early on that Chris was a bit of a plant by the producers. Luckily, the subject was that interesting to me that I didn't turn off because otherwise I would have. I am not a fan of Reality TV and generally don't watch it. Especially when it is constructed just to artificially create tensions, then always I'm gone.

    Actually, it didn't surprise me at all that the doctor being gay wasn't a problem, though the programme was edited. In my experience, the ordinary, but adventurous 'younger person' tends not to be a knuckle dragger. Issues like homophobia are handed down from previous generations to younger people who steadfastly remain ignorant, where it's comfortable. That's generalising a lot in a couple of sentences, but outdated attitudes are generally handed over from previous ignorant generations. Personally [and I think we've written about this before], I think I am of a generation that was educated not to homophobic, xenophobic, racist [and lots of other human prejudices] although my family were reasonably OK in that respect anyway. I find that enlightened younger people don't 'see' differences first, but commonalities.

    As for Bligh, I've always found him an interesting character. In not a single Hollywood film is he quite portrayed as recorded. In the 1930's Laughton/Gable film he's a cheating tyrant almost from the word go. In the 1960's Howard/Brando film he's initially undermined by a foppish Christian, because he's not a Captain, but merely a Commander, before adopting the tyrannical nature, and in the 1980's Hopkins/Gibson version there's a sort of chemistry between Hopkins and Gibson which is most odd. Mind you, I've never liked that version so my memory of it is pretty vague on one viewing. However, it's probably the most accurate of the films, taking its inspiration from a different book.

    Anyone can read notes of the events leading up to the initial voyage to Tahiti and in almost every case the Admiralty screwed up, in my opinion. The purchased little merchant ship is too small for the rigours of the voyage; the crew are too few; there are no Marines to defend the ship; Bligh has no RN command experience [to date he'd been a captain in the Merchant fleet]; and Christian is certainly not upto his responsibilities. The voyage starts at the wrong time, so they are forced to round Cape Horn, which they fail to do, so they take the long passage to Tahiti. When they get there the breadfruit is not in the right condition for transplanting to the Caribbean, so they stay there for months and discipline unravels. Well, would you want to leave.? There's little doubt that whilst Bligh was a bit short on command abilities, he was an extraordinary navigator and seaman. He did learn directly from Captain James Cook, so he was well tutored.

    I think it may be the first recorded case of GB trying to do great things on a shoestring and coming unstuck. :rolleyes:
     
    #31236
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  17. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    It's funny how people who don't have pets don't understand this. Some of my non dog owning friends cannot understand how I can devote so much time and money to my dogs to make sure they are ok. We didn't go abroad for 6 years as we didn't want to leave the dogs - it wasn't until my daughter got married in Atlanta that we actually left them in Kennels for the first time...we couldn't really not go to our daughter's wedding! They actually love it now as they get a holiday too :)

    They are both 8 this year and I can't imagine life without them - they are as much a part of the family as any children :emoticon-0152-heart
     
    #31237
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  18. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    People who are not pet owners/lovers ( no matter what type of pet ) will never understand !
     
    #31238
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  19. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    Stop feeding those cats. See how much they love you then <laugh>
     
    #31239
  20. Whiteley Saint

    Whiteley Saint Well-Known Member

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    I am currently typing with a cat asleep on my lap and a dog asleep by my side. Who needs central heating? :)
     
    #31240

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