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Effect of Brexit

Discussion in 'Watford' started by Davylad, Mar 26, 2016.

  1. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    Today, South Africa's trade minister vowed to start immediate trade talks with the UK so they are complete by the Brexit date. Brussels officials seem to have softened their opposition to the UK discussing trade deals with international partners. It is now understood any enforcement action they could initiate would probably take longer than two years to conclude, meaning Britain would already have left the EU.
     
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  2. Bolton's Boots

    Bolton's Boots Well-Known Member

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    I tend to think that that applies to quite a few countries, not just England, and as you say, politicians of all persuasions seem to think that they know best. I 'lived through' the hell that was Outcomes Based Education in Australia - insisted upon by conservative politicians who knew best, even though it was a system that had failed & been scrapped in at least three other countries prior to the Howard Government thinking it was a good idea. Fortunately, the commonsense of teachers there prevailed and it was booted out before too much damage could be done. I wasn't best pleased to find it being brought in here in Scotland when I arrived, but have to admit that the previous system was in poor shape and needed revamping. At least kids here are now being taught to think for themselves as opposed to being force fed facts that they may or may not be able to regurgitate when expected to.
     
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  3. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    I never thought I would agree with anything Diane Abbott ever said. She is probably the most accomplished political contortionist in British politics. Diane is infamous for lecturing the nation on the evils of selective schools only to send her own child to a public school. Her support for her one time lover, and leader, Corbyn gave her the courage to rubbish everything she had droned on about Brexit for the last six months. To save his skin after his appalling performance in parliament this week and looming defeat in the forthcoming bi-elections she suddenly sounded like Nigel Farage. There was finally an admission that immigration played a major part in the referendum and that the result was undeniable. Woe betide any Labour MP who dares to defy the three line whip.

    Nothing now surprises me in politics, perhaps Diane can be UKIP's new leader?
     
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  4. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if Mexico will be looking for a good trade deal with the UK. I suspect its trade with the USA is going to nose dive
     
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  5. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Mexico already has more free trade deals than any other country in the World, and can be expected to expand these under the present circumstances. Could be a prime target for Chinese investment in the future - wouldn't that get up Trump's nose ? Many German firms are also very active in Mexico. Personally I would want to buy Mexican products out of solidarity now, but I don't know how to get my hands on them.
     
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    yorkshirehornet likes this.
  6. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    Not much future for German firms in Mexico exporting to the US, two of Trump's most dislikes. An unknown firm has pulled out of a 100 million euro deal with a German car supplier, presumably due to pressure from Trump.
     
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  7. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Is everyone in the World supposed to shiver or shake, or jump cartwheels according to whether Trump likes them or not ? Is this your idea of sovereignty - boosted by whether Trump likes you or not ?
     
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  8. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure European senior politicians, especially German, are very concerned with Trump's anti EU, and especially, anti German statements. One thing he has proved, so far, is his rhetoric has not been toned down once in office. I think it is a massive boost to the UK to have such support, it will concentrate the minds of the EU negotiators.
     
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  9. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Is this along the lines of 'If you don't play ball with us we'll get big brother to help' ? How very 'sovereign' of you. It's about time the World stopped dancing to America's tune - the EU. is the most successfull market in the World already, and America cannot stop being overtaken by China at some stage in the future - do you want to pin all your hopes on a 'has been' whose only remaining claim to World power status is military ?
     
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  10. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
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    Largest export to the USA from the UK is cars, made with bits from all over the EU. I assume he will still want to allow them in.
     
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  11. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    I thought you would want to congratulate May and Trump for declaring they will not be invading other sovereign countries in future. With hindsight it was better to have left those nasty but west leaning dictators in power rather than try to impose 'western democracy' on them. Pity it took so much damage and loss of life to come to such conclusion.

    The US will remain a very important world power for a long time. Countries all around the world are looking to enhance trade with the UK, including China and India.

    I am in agreement with Trump that Germany has manipulated the EU for its own gains. By locking the struggling Southern nations within the EU it has the effect of keeping the value of the Euro artificially low for a successful exporting nation like Germany. If Germany had its own currency it would very strong therefore its exports would be much more expensive and less attractive to foreign buyers. Trump will try everything to correct what he sees as unfair competition, expect the worse if he remains in power.
     
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  12. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    You appear to adhere to some kind of conspiracy theory in relation to Germany SH. Did Germany force any other country to join the EU ? The same applies to the Euro. The Southern European countries were more in favour of it than Germany was. Nobody has 'locked' anyone into anything. The only policies which Germany can be accused of are 1. The austerity doctrine of the Merkel government (which may well change after the elections this year) and 2. That Germany has an inbalanced economy and therefore does not operate as a 'market' for European produce in the way it should do.
     
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  13. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    What is really important is not what I think but what Trump thinks. Germany is clearly in Trump's sights. No country has benefitted from the Euro as much as Germany, they are certainly financially gaining from the suffering of other countries. Apart from Brexit I think we can expect major changes in Europe in the next few years.

    Countries such as France and Germany will be forced to contribute more towards NATO as previously agreed by them, and pay the agreed percentage for hardware etc. May will be an important ally for Trump to secure this so he does not have to threaten to unilaterally reduce America's unfairly high current contributions.
     
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  14. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Personally I am not remotely interested in what Trump thinks (does he think at all ?). I have seen that TM has come out with something like 'The UK. and the USA can lead the World', is she suffering from delusions of grandeur ? The 2 countries make up less than 5% of the World's population. You have frequently stated that the EU. was a failed model, and used this as one justification for leaving - what about the USA ? Its infrastructure is in chaos, it has a massive trade deficit, massive debts (mostly to China), cannot protect its own population against being shot by their neighbours (or by the police), cannot bring massive swathes of its population out of poverty, cannot react to national emergencies such as the New Orleans floodings (they were offered medical assistance from Cuba for this one). Need I go on - more like a coalition of cripples rather than leaders of the World. Whatever Trump thinks does not really matter - because he is not the USA. Just as Obama was not able to do everything he wanted, so, the same will come to pass with Trump. For every issue which involves state expenditure he needs the support of Congress, the Presidency being nothing like as powerfull as we think it to be. As for NATO, we should get out of it as quickly as possible.
     
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  15. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    Nobody is suggesting Trump can do what he likes but the Republicans currently have complete control, unlike Obama who had to get his policies past the opposition. Trump certainly seems to be pushing his agenda without too much opposition yet, time will tell.
     
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  16. Toby

    Toby GC's Life Coach

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    Cologne you forgot that to see the world through the eyes of a Brexiter you need to set yourself 50-70 years ago, the reality of the 21st century isn't as appealing to them.
     
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  17. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

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    I think that both sides of this argument make some good points. LIke it or not we are leaving the EU. The question has to be what is the best for the UK moving forward. Trade deals with other countries become ever more important and the USA is a large market so an important one to do a good trade deal with. Similarly with Mexico, China, Australia etc etc. We need to do the best deal possible with those other countries - it is as simple as that. Whether or not we like their human rights records or any other aspect of their domestic policy is something we may want to comment on - but ultimately are powerless to affect. If countries only do trade deals with like minded countries world trade would plunge.
    The EU came very close to a deal with the USA. Had it been completed we would have been part of it like it or not. Perhaps on our own we can try to tailor a deal with the USA more specifically to our liking.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 27, 2017
  18. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Should we really do a 'god' trade with the USA. Leo - we don't want their brand of Evangelism over here. <laugh>
     
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  19. Leo

    Leo Well-Known Member

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    I failed my RSA typing :) Edited - ta
     
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  20. Toby

    Toby GC's Life Coach

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    How can you trust the Tories to get a deal that's beneficial for the people of this country? (by 'people' I mean the general population)
     
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