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Article: Can Jenson Button Win in the Dry? | Formula One

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Stephen Lickorish, Aug 9, 2011.

  1. Prime Minister Cameron

    Prime Minister Cameron New Member

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    It's too late for that mate. He is pushing as hard as he can on raw speed but we all simply know he can't beat Hamilton on that. So he focuses on Setup and Startegy because he is the best driver on the grid at that in my opinion.
     
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  2. Basil_Brushzenberger

    Basil_Brushzenberger New Member

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    I beg your pardon. I hadn't realised you did it scientifically.
     
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  3. Basil_Brushzenberger

    Basil_Brushzenberger New Member

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    But of course. Walked into that one. lol
     
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  4. di Fredsta!

    di Fredsta! Well-Known Member

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    Cowboy, with your experiment, are you normally an aggressive or smooth driver?
    I would like to think I am a smooth driver but aggressive when needed. I got stupidly bored when grinding GT5 A spec level 40 so I did the same experiment, but in a different car. As i'm lazy, I used the X2010 (not a real car, may be a bit off) 4 laps over the Nurburgring Nordschleife (one stint) and when I was aggressive I got the faster lap by about half a second, which over 4 minutes and 40 seconds is nothing, but the tyres were gone much easier and my last lap was in the 4 50's. Then I did my normal style which is just be smooth, dont try too hard and be consistant. All my lap times were within a few seconds of each other and by best was about 4:40.8.

    If we were to do this experiment, we would need X amount of aggressive drivers and X amount of smooth. Just because if you change your driving style you lose time automatically, or atleast i find that.

    PS. This is with a controller.
     
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  5. Vilsmeier-Haack Reaction

    Vilsmeier-Haack Reaction Well-Known Member

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    I may get shot down for this (as I have before) but do you think it is a coincidence that both ferrari's were GT- Am drivers. Performace gap not the problem, unfamiliar Amateur drivers were I feel
     
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  6. u408379965

    u408379965 Well-Known Member

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    Button's problem is his qualifying performances. He makes life difficult for himself in the race, in dry conditions it's virtually impossible to come through the field to win, a topsy-turvy race throws up more opportunities which JB is fantastic at grabbing with both hands.
     
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  7. McLarenDan

    McLarenDan Member

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    Button isn't the faster driver is the cold hard fact. He's above average, maybe 6-7th fastest balls out speed? It means his qualifying isn't great, and often he simply doesn't have the pace without everything being thrown in the air. He's at least very good at catching it when it does get thrown in the air(if often he is extremely lucky).
     
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  8. Masanari

    Masanari Active Member

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    Do not really agree with that, when Button has the car set up to his liking he can qualify well and in race trim can be as fast as anybody on the grid.

    I agree with AG, Button's problem is that he usually does not qualify high enough up the grid and loses time to the leaders as he is fighting his way back up the grid. However when he does qualify well he is up there fighting with the leaders and challenging for the win, it is only a bit of bad luck that has prevented him winning a race in the dry at Mclaren.
     
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  9. McLarenDan

    McLarenDan Member

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    Well when the car is perfect anyone can drive it. It's like saying when he's driving a F2004 he could put it on pole; sure. But take in mind even in 2009 when Rubens got his brakes issue sorted he consistantly outqualified Button... and old Barrichello is being outqualified by a rookie pay driver...

    I can't remember the last time Jenson outqualified Lewis where it wasn't a strategic error made by McLaren ala Monaco. (I may be wrong here, inform me... maybe China? But I think Lewis was being tyre friendly...)
     
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  10. cosicave

    cosicave Well-Known Member

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    No: perhaps it's no coincidence Jacky.

    I've raced in plenty of Pro-Am events. It is well worth remembering that there can be some relatively inexperienced drivers out there.
    It can be a dicey business when congested, or catching a slower driver at what might be an unexpected moment. Amateur drivers may sometimes take unconventional lines and are often less consistent with choosing a braking point, but by far the greatest danger is presented through a lack of anticipation. It is therefore incumbent upon the professional to anticipate the possible lack of anticipation!

    Of course, the above can be no more than a generalisation and I do not know the details of the incidents you are speaking of; so what I have just written may not be applicable to these guys. Also, some of the amateurs can be quite professional in their whole approach to racing. Two more points worth making: no-one gets into these events without serious tutoring, but ultimately there can be no real substitute for experience.
     
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  11. Masanari

    Masanari Active Member

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    I never said 'perfect' I said when he has it set up to his liking, there is a difference. In the latter half of 2009 Barrichello might of consistantly outqualified Button but in the races it was 5-5 and the reason why Button was struggling to qualify well was not really Barrichello's improved performance or a lack of ability but really because of a lack of heat in his tyres.

    The problem is that whenever Button outqualifies Hamilton there is always an excuse, it is either Mclaren screwed Hamilton, or Hamilton was trying to save his tyres, blah blah blah. And by the way it was Silverstone the last time Button outqualifed Hamilton.

    Anyway it is where you finish in the race that matters and so far this season Button is driving in the races brilliantly wet or dry.
     
    #51
  12. di Fredsta!

    di Fredsta! Well-Known Member

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    I think Button is at his best this year. And imo out racing Hamilton, if it wasnt for his 2 mechanical problems in Silverstone (Pretty much a podium, maybe a 2nd place) and Germany (Atleast 5th, maybe 4th) he would have been in 2nd in the championship.
     
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  13. EternalMSC

    EternalMSC Well-Known Member

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    Technical problems have to occur, if Schumacher didn't have any you wouldn't be wanting him to leave as much as you want right now, because he would be right on the tail of Rosberg in the standings, and that's the truth.
    Jensen could have been 2nd.. coulda..woulda..shoulda.. it happens.
     
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  14. di Fredsta!

    di Fredsta! Well-Known Member

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    Schumacher has had car problems? Since when?
     
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  15. Prime Minister Cameron

    Prime Minister Cameron New Member

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    And that is why he amazingly 12 points behind his teammate.
     
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  16. Prime Minister Cameron

    Prime Minister Cameron New Member

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    2nd in Silverstone??!!! That's a crazy suggestion. I think 4th was lined up for him not 2nd
     
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  17. mephistopheles

    mephistopheles Member

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    Apparently since he returned to racing last year
     
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  18. Stephen Lickorish

    Stephen Lickorish Member

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    Yes, perhaps the title should end with "any more", after his lack of dry wins recently.

    But in fact, Button has been racing much better this year (his wet wins were brilliant) and has been let down by mistakes, reliability issues and some poor qualifying positions. The point I'm getting at is that it's strange he hasn't won in the dry for 2 years and perhaps this is why he hasn't been a main championship contender.
     
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  19. Masanari

    Masanari Active Member

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    please log in to view this image


    <laugh>
     
    #59
  20. di Fredsta!

    di Fredsta! Well-Known Member

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    He was battling with Webber who got told not to overtake Vettel. I think Button could have had them both.
     
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