When is it "understandable" to riot?

<funnyironypic>

 

I hardly think you can compare the behaviour of Holocaust targets to that of people who have to watch a parade go past the window. Just close your curtains, Ciaran

 

Both about the removal of rights, both in an atmosphere of exerting a sense of superiority.....

no comparison at all.

 

Yes, maybe I was generalising a little too much. Some people around the world are terribly oppressed, people are tortured, killed, denied democracy. I can understand these people rioting. But people rioting because some gun-wielding, drug-dealing scrote has been shot? People rioting because of a march in their area? Not for me.

As for your assumption about my knowledge of the OO in NI, why presume that just because something happens outside my own backyard I know nothing about it? I've read up on all kinds of things including Khan's *****ls, Caesar's Rome, Feudalistic Japan, so me knowing a little about something on the next island isn't that amazing is it?

 

That was the catalyst for all this kicking off. The looting now is rooted in that but any sense of political ideal behind it has been lost very rapidly.

I should add, I entirely understand why it went off in Tottenham on saturday night. anywhere else thereafter, I don't get at all.

 

The looting is due to criminal elements sensing weakness. They saw how restricted and outnumbered the police were on Saturday night, and thought "I'll have a bit of that myself. As for events in Tottenham, I don't understand that. If a dangerous local criminal had been killed, I'd be pleased. Unless I was a criminal myself, of course.

The Orange Order had a central place in the new state of Northern Ireland. From 1921 to 1969, every Prime Minister of Northern Ireland was an Orangeman and member of the Ulster Unionist Party (UUP); all but three Cabinet Ministers were Orangemen; all but one unionist Senators were Orangemen; and 87 of the 95 MPs who did not become Cabinet Ministers were Orangemen. James Craig, the first Prime Minister of Northern Ireland, maintained always that Ulster was in effect Protestant and the symbol of its ruling forces was the Orange Order. In 1932, Prime Minister Craig maintained that "ours is a Protestant government and I am an Orangeman". Two years later he stated: "I have always said that I am an Orangeman first and a politician and a member of this parliament afterwards&#8230;All I boast is that we have a Protestant Parliament and a Protestant State".

At its peak in 1965, the Order's membership was around 70,000, which meant that roughly 1 in 5 adult Protestant males were members. Since 1965, it has lost a third of its membership, notably in Belfast and Derry. The Order's political influence suffered greatly when the Unionist-dominated Northern Ireland Parliament was prorogued in 1972.

After the outbreak of "The Troubles" in 1969, the Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland encouraged Orangemen to join the Northern Ireland security forces&#8212;namely the Royal Ulster Constabulary (RUC) and the British Army's Ulster Defence Regiment (UDR). The response from Orangemen was strong. Over 300 Orangemen were killed during the conflict, the vast majority of them members of the security forces. Some Orangemen also joined loyalist paramilitaries. During the conflict, the Order had a fractious relationship with loyalist paramilitaries, the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP), the Independent Orange Order and the Free Presbyterian Church. The Order urged its members not to join these organisations, and it is only recently that some of these intra-Unionist breaches have been healed.

The Drumcree dispute is perhaps the most well-known episode involving the Order since 1921. On the Sunday before 12 July each year, the Order holds its "Drumcree parade" in Portadown, when it marches to-and-from Drumcree Church. It has marched this route since 1807, when the area was sparsely populated. However, today most of this route falls within the town's mainly-Catholic and nationalist quarter, which is densely populated. The residents have sought to re-route the parade away from this area, seeing it as "triumphalist" and "supremacist".

In 1995, the dispute drew worldwide media attention as it led to widespread protests and rioting throughout Northern Ireland. This wave of violence began when Catholic and nationalist protestors prevented the march from continuing along Garvaghy Road. This pattern was repeated every July for the next four years. During that time the dispute led to the deaths of at least five civilians and prompted a massive police and army operation. Since 1998 the parade has been banned from most of the nationalist area, and the violence has subsided. However, regular moves to get the two sides into face-to-face talks have failed.

 

i think he meant your understanding, not wiki's.

The events in Tottenham came after a man was shot, a bogus story was circulated. A peaceful demo took place to get answers. The police said they'd give these answers. These answers were not forthcoming people grew frustrated and trouble broke out.

Against a backdrop of operation trident which is racial profiling and rightly or wrongly is perceived as an instrument of the state against a particular community. Combine that with stop and search methods of the police which, again, rightly or wrongly is perceived as an instrument of the state against a particular community I can absolutely understand how this happened in Tottenham.

 

I ****ing hate John

 

edward is just playing a role. He's a sound shkin.