I may not be able to you're right as it would be harder to get a ticket... but then an expansion becomes more realistic/viable no? If it was cheaper I (and others) may be more able to go for a season ticket though. I agree with your point regarding that from a business perspective our prices are about right for size of stadium etc. The problem with thar is that it also doesn't make sense to pay out for an expansion/new stadium and then decrease prices... this is why West Ham are laughing so much as they're in a position (due to the deal they got) to offer a lot less than many of their competitors. No club ever (that I can think of) paid out for a new ground or expansion and immediately dropped prices. What if they were decreased before with the plan to expand once waiting lists hit a certain figure? Maybe even an incentive that all ST holders and those on waiting list could have a price freeze for first 2/3 seasons at new ground? Would get people into the habit which is a big thing imo. As for where I sit generally Northam or Kingsland/Itchen corner. Not sure where cheapest seats our but would imagine it's the corners? That will change in a year or so when I start taking my lad anyway.
Well that sparked a reaction, didn't it? Beefy, I am aware that the written word is open to interpretation. Don't think I was having a go at you on this ticket price thing, I am genuinely interested in the question of price sensitivity in this area. I wholly agree that prices seem high. My missus and I have got into live gigs and Liverpool/Manchester theatres for less than I pay to get into SMS on occasions. I have also pondered this question of whether ticket receipts actually matter. I thought it had something to do with FFP rules, being largely ignorant of these. Perhaps one of you clever people could enlighten us? Travelling back from the Liverpool game I met a group of very drunk Coventry fans who fell onto the train at Oxford. After the usual conversation with fans of that club about our lucky escape in the ownership stakes, one of them was describing his time of living in Germany and buying a season ticket for a top club for not much more than a single ticket at Arsenal. So yes, I agree tickets are too expensive and, unless told otherwise, accept that ticket revenue is a minute portion of income. I remain to be convinced that we would suddenly attract 40,000 + to home games. My problem, I think, is that on every visit to Southampton and its environs I am struck by what seems to be an increase in the number of Liverpool and Man Utd car stickers and shirts. I have said in the past that I am genuinely surprised to find that on a match day people in shops and pubs can ask me who we are playing. This is not a conversation I have ever had in Liverpool, for example. When I lived there, the woman in my corner shop told me she wasn't a big fan of football, yet every week she knew which of the two teams was at home and who they were playing. As I have said above, outside the clique which is our mad and wonderful fan base there doesn't seem to be the interest. Of course success breeds success. Winning the FA Cup would help - more than the League Cup which has less of a profile. Doing a Leicester could transform things. Friends in Italy who are football mad are very much aware of the Foxes. But how many times is a club like LCFC going to keep the usual suspects at bay? I hope we haven't plateaued, and that you are right about the potential. Whatever, I've always enjoyed being a Saint - through lots of thin and occasional thick - and am certainly doing so now. Some great players, many just passing through it is true. The academy starting to produce the goods again. A very good manager, whatever his critics may say. And, of course, the best fans in the world! COYR
I think as a club we need to speculate to accumulate. Expand to a 40,000 seater stadium with capacity to expand further. We won't fill it immediately, but it gives us the opportunity to try and build the fanbase. Free and cheap tickets to kids etc.
Sunderland who get attendances of 40k+, would see home gates tumble to around 30k which would amount to 35% of the stadium being uuoccupied in the Championship. We see the same for all the bigger clubs in the Championship n League 1 where around 30% of the ground is empty - at Leeds, Sheffield Wednesday, Sheffield United, Wolves, Birmingham, Ipswich, Forest, Cardiff, Bristol City now!!! Southampton experienced this not too long ago. So the issue is do Southampton at some stage expand the stadium in the hope of attracting 35k+ for most matches in the PL or stay as they are?
With a lot of fans calling for further investment into the first team squad, I think this would anger a lot of fans. Id certainly rather see us heavily invest in the playing squad and win a trophy and regularly get european football and THEN think about stadium expansion. Would you accept a stadium expansion if it meant limited spending whilst still selling our best players for big money?
The flip side of the 'gate money is now largely irrelevant now we have sky money' is that although it means they could reduce ticket prices to get more in/save the fans money, there is no incentive for a new stadium. A 50,000 seater stadium would not bring in that much more income if the prices were reduced than the 33,000 we have now. Quick maths: 33,000 x £30 = 990,000 50,000 x £20 = 1,000,000 Yep 10,000 per game more. And we'd have to fill it. And we'd have to build it. Though we would make money on those extra 17,000 if they turned up.
It's a balancing act to be sure to be sure. Longer term, if we want to break the glass ceiling, I think it's necessary. How often does a season like Leicester had last season happen? And look at them this season. At the moment, it's hard to see us break out of the circle we're in with buying in for relatively cheap good players with potential and selling them on for big profit. Even a cup win is unlikely to change anything in terms of the glass ceiling. I'm just saying, if we ultimately want to be consistantly challenging among the Top 4, I think we'll be looking at expanding the stadium. Potentially very interesting times ahead with whatever the potential takeover might bring.
Sky money may not be there forever....or at least not at its present level. Sky have been making cuts recently. No financially sound company would go mad based on something that could be taken away. However, that could be an argument for a stadium expansion.....if the paying customers become more important for a club. The problems remain though....where would it go (if new) and what would an expansion of the present stadium cost. All comes down to number crunching.....and we've only just done the expansion of the training ground.
I've lost count of the number of my customers who are running down their contracts with Sky. Now a degree of that is hot air and they may renew but I genuinely don't find many people singing Sky's praises. You also need to add in the effect of free online streaming of pretty much everything on platforms like Kodi. I know Sky is in super-duper HD but given the choice between footy in HD for £60 a month or streamed for £4 (or free) I know what people are probably going to prefer. The internet has radically altered the music business, the film business and the DVD rental business. I suspect it'll be doing the same to live TV shortly. The long-term implication of that would be a pretty major reduction in the amount Sky might be willing to pay for footy. Anyone making long-term plans based upon the gravy train never derailing is asking for trouble. Vin
Matchday revenue is not the only reason for stadium expansion - it's also the prestige it brings; a 40-50k stadium is part of what makes a "big club". We could be top 6, with the occasional foray into top 4 and a cup or two for years (a.k.a. Spurs/Liverpool over the last decade) and never become recognised as a "Big club" until we start filling a 40/50k stadium. And without that recognition off-field sponsorship etc. is that much harder to get. The real problem is we don't have that same wider football culture they have in Manchester/Liverpool down here, really anywhere South of London. Until we have some sustained success - perhaps winning a couple of FA cups or something, it won't arise, either. Success breeds football culture but without the culture, there's no point in a bigger stadium from a financial POV. We're stuck in a chicken/egg situation - do we take a risk and expand hoping to try and grow that football culture here or do we play it safe? I'm glad the choice isn't down to me!
Yep, I was analysing the way we have changed in the no7 house over the last year. Very rarely watch live tv (or tv programs when they are actually on). 90% of our viewing is Netflix/NowTV/Kodi including streaming the Footie. The Netflix & NowTV came 'free' with our phone contracts otherwise it would all be Kodi. That said, I do still pay Sky (via Virgin) for sky sports. I use the streaming in the rooms I don't have a virgin box (like the kitchen). So yep, Sky may reduce what they are paying soon, but maybe the overseas rights make up for it?
Don't think we sold out to Hapoel did we? And the price for that was what, £18, for a European decider? No way would we ever get regular crowds of 40,000 imo.
Well absolutely. The one thing that holds us back as a club at this time is our wage structure. This is what keeps our players (or more likely their agents) from staying here more than a couple of seasons. Until we build our commercial revenue we can't radically improve our wage structure. Although ticket sales in themselves are a relatively minor part of our income compared to Sky money, surely by increasing that income stream we would also indirectly improve sponsorship money and thereby qualify ourselves to pay higher wages under FFP? Having said that, I agree we can't expand the stadium or build a new one until we sell out more often than we do, and get our average percentage sales above the roughly 95% they are now. If we can get up to around the 98% that clubs like Sunderland, Leicester, and Bournemouth achieve, that would be the trigger point for investment. The club have stated this on more than one occasion, and it makes perfect sense on a commercial basis. The question is, how do we do that? I would say there are a number of ways. Obviously number one is establishing the club permanently in the top half of the Premier League and winning a cup or two. Secondly, reduce ticket prices, to encourage the occasional fans to become regular, and the regular to become season ticket holders. Thirdly, improve access to the ground. Southampton is a small city but the club is the largest in the country outside London and south of Birmingham. We should, and do, attract people from Bristol and South Wales, Devon and Somerset, and all the way along the South Coast, but the ground is a complete nightmare to get away from after matches unless you know a few rat runs, so occasional visitors may well be put off ever coming again. If there was a train station nearer the ground, and a proper park and ride, it would surely be easier to get more fans from outside the city to attend more regularly?
I dumped sky about 12 months ago - they have now called me and given me the same package I used to have for nothing for 12 months. As long as I cancel in time, it won't cost me a penny. My Father in law also got offered 12 months free after he cancelled his subscription. Methinks Sky have some big problems coming unless they can somehow protect their media from being streamed.
Why do you think Sky have Now TV, they are getting ready for the future. Normal TV is dying out and it will soon be about stream programmes when ever you want. Sky will still be a big player sadly.
Sorry to disagree....but rule one for me is always to improve a product so that it gives the public what they need and want and can't get anywhere else. You set the price according to quality of the product
While I agree with you on the last point, this may not be the best barometer. I once read that our fans are one of the most scattered bunch in the League.. I certainly know a fair few "Northern Saints", and a Thursday night game is a tough call if you've been working in the day. But a home league game at a weekend against any team should be close to a sell-out if the claim that there is sufficient interest for expansion is credible
Yeah you (and everyone on top) is right. Who knows what it means for football. By the way you can replace "Sky" with "BBC/Licence Fee" and it all still applies.
