The Politics Thread
- Thread starter Wandering Yid
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It may seem that way if music from those locales is all you are exposed to.
How much of this is down to familiarity, though? Lots of countries speak English, so the music spreads further.
If there's a particularly original band in a non-English speaking country, then they probably still won't get much coverage here.
They'd probably have to speak Spanish to be influential across multiple continents.
The only Spanish native-language artist that breaks about the top 50 in sales is Julio Iglesias.
Was he innovative? I've got no idea.
Carlos Santana, maybe? The language is irrelevant there, admittedly.
I await the inevitable Babymetal link from Croydon. No doubt that they're very different.
Short answer
No.
Long answer
While it may appear that all popular culture flows through Airstrip One, the fact is that it doesn't and we are only exposed to a very limited amount of what other countries produce. For example, how many songs in a non-English language have been breakthrough hits in the UK? Off the top of my head, I'd say Je t'aime… moi non plus, 99 Luftballoons and Gangnam Style.
In years gone by, not singing in English was seen as a reason to not invest time promoting an artist outside of their cultural sphere, for example you could probably count people in the UK who had heard of Shakira before 2001 let alone bought her four albums on one hand - but when she made her English-language debut she became pretty damn huge pretty damn quick. It's telling how for a long time there was a belief that singing in a language that isn't English would alienate potential listeners, hence tATu was re-recorded in English (even though the song sounds WAY better in Russian), while English language versions of some Rammstein tracks were recorded, even though Du Hast loses all its meaning if translated into English.
It is telling that so many artists who aren't from the US/UK corridor that became big have sidestepped the language barrier, either by singing in English (ABBA, Shaikira, Bjork) or making music that doesn't require vocals (Kraftwerk, Jean-Michel Jarre, Air, Daft Punk) - but the reality is that a quick trip to Youtube will show not only the creativity and originality that exists in other countries, but also how big they are.
This goes a long way to explaining why Gangnam Style blew up in the way that it did, to the point it currently has 2.7bn views on Youtube: PSY already had a huge fanbase in Korea, which got the video for Gangnam Style onto Youtube's algorithms, and because the song was catchy enough and/or the video was quirky enough it picked up traction in the West - something made much more likely by the advent of digital downloads.
There's also another way to look at it: for years we were told how Robbie Williams was the biggest pop star we had, yet nobody in the US had a clue who the bloody hell he was. Lucky Americans...
J-Pop and K-Pop both approach this issue in the same way: switch to English for either a line, or even a couple of words, as it helps the flow.
There is one obvious issue with this, however - namely how switching between English and another language on the fly can sometimes sound utterly bizarre to a non-native speaker, for example how the entire English-speaking world thinks they can hear the sentence "I got a boy on my chin" in this song...
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I think the bottom line is that the merits of anything to do with the arts - especially music - is subjective. But I still don't see any countries around the world producing music as culturally resonant/significant/influential as here or the U.S. However, that's a personal opinion based on my personal tastes. Who's to say Whigfield isn't the important artist in the history of rock'n'roll?
Joni MItchell, Bob Marley & the Pogues, for me, though I've probably forgotten some, and am anything but the world's best informed music fan. The US and the UK have dominated blues based electrified music because it was invented in the US and taken up as a kind of religion in the UK, who transformed it into something bigger, because I think the UK is much more attuned to style and fashion than the US is. Between the head start and the media capitals of the world being London and New York, with Los Angeles not far behind, and English being the media's dominant language, it's hard for people from other countries to compete. The countries which have had the most impact have been the ones sitting on the doorstep, I think, Ireland and Canada. Canada, in particular, has had any number of notable musicians, including Neil Young and Robbie Robertson.
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If you define popular music by the standards of the UK and the USA then of course they dominate. Music traditions all over the world produce great artists.
The Buena Vista Social Club for example
or the many African and Indian artists.Every country will produce great artists but the insular UK & USA will only be interested in English speakers.
The Buena Vista Social Club for example
or the many African and Indian artists.Every country will produce great artists but the insular UK & USA will only be interested in English speakers.
My favourite band is Horslips who are Irish - but I didn't know that when I first heard them. They did the occasional song in gaelic and had a lot of traditional influences on their music. I guess that it another folk rock stream that has always been popular. My favourite non-English language songs are L'amour est bleu, which was unbelievably a Eurovision song of the 60s but doesn't sound like it and Vado Via which is from the 70s and in Italian, which was a minor hit. Don't forget Gaudete (Steelye Span 1972) which was actually sung in Latin, but could probably be regarded as a novelty hit. Having said that, none of these examples have had a major impact on the charts. The only others I recall which have not been mentioned are Rock Me Amadeus, Ca Plane Pour Moi and La Bamba. I wonder if JeTaime has been the biggest non-English hit? It was of course banned so we'll never know.
Another trope is for some songs to have an unexplicably French bit, where the English lyrics are repeated but in French. I can thing of Denis by Blondie, Hold on Tight by ELO, Michelle by The Beatles and Fade to Grey by Visage.
Another trope is for some songs to have an unexplicably French bit, where the English lyrics are repeated but in French. I can thing of Denis by Blondie, Hold on Tight by ELO, Michelle by The Beatles and Fade to Grey by Visage.
S
Spur of the Moment
Guest
I just assumed Louise Mensch had tweeted yet another imbecilic comment about how the world outside America is a cultural wasteland - and when called out on it she promptly deleted it, because like all Tories she fails to understand how screengrabs work.
...oh yeah, that reminds me: Leonard Cohen was Canadian - not American, as the proto Priti Patel claimed.
She's hardly unique among Tories, as so many of them can be fairly described as swaggering, if incompetent, bullies. The exact same can be said for Theresa may, David Cameron, Boris Johnson, George Osborne, Louise Mensch and Amber Rudd, among many, many others.
Actually, Kraftwerk had (insisted ?? ) their LPs released in both German and English.
Which allows people to judge a bit for themselves my general comments about the
sound/flow of German (in some cases they stuck with German and it is good enough :
Autobahn, Airwaves etc) .
Even if it was true that English/USA pop dominated the world disproportionately surely wondering if that means if the US/UK are particularly excellent at making pop music is a bit like wondering if Coca Cola make the best beverage or McDonald's the best food or if James Cameron makes the very best films or Budweiser the best beer or Simon Cowell the best TV. It's not the product. It's the marketing. Maybe also the price and various cultural common denominators (the English language in the pop context and the human predilection for, in the case of McDonald's, salt and sugar and in the case of Budweiser water).
Also people in other countries can stand listening to languages other than their own in a way that Americans and English people can't in general. So French people listen to American music quite happily but an American, well, let's be honest - doesn't even know where France is on a map and much less want to listen to that foreign terrorist-sounding noises.
And about one or two companies own all the commercial radio stations in the UK don't they? There's probably a handful that own all the English-speaking commercial stations in the world. (It was certanly getting that way about 10 years or so ago when I last looked into it). If some geezer in Mali makes good music that's totally irrelevant to them. There is no way that guy is going to sell trainers or make-up. Pepsi do not want to be endorsed by that twat.
Also people in other countries can stand listening to languages other than their own in a way that Americans and English people can't in general. So French people listen to American music quite happily but an American, well, let's be honest - doesn't even know where France is on a map and much less want to listen to that foreign terrorist-sounding noises.
And about one or two companies own all the commercial radio stations in the UK don't they? There's probably a handful that own all the English-speaking commercial stations in the world. (It was certanly getting that way about 10 years or so ago when I last looked into it). If some geezer in Mali makes good music that's totally irrelevant to them. There is no way that guy is going to sell trainers or make-up. Pepsi do not want to be endorsed by that twat.
When somebody who penned an incendiary expose of the Camorra says the UK is the world's most corrupt country, that certainly says a lot: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...tain-corrupt-mafia-hay-festival-a7054851.html
I would disagree that the UK financial sector is corrupt, and if so nowhere near
the levels (that have been) found in Italy.
However, there is IMHO an unacceptably high amoral tone that has led to the
prospect that unchecked "dirty money" is invested in the London property
market etc.
the levels (that have been) found in Italy.
However, there is IMHO an unacceptably high amoral tone that has led to the
prospect that unchecked "dirty money" is invested in the London property
market etc.
Theresa May's solution to six months of Southern staff going on strike? Rather than sanction Southern for being a ****ing awful rail service, either with fines or stripping them of the franchise, instead she considers banning anyone who works for a rail company from going on strike.
While everyone's banging on about Russia influencing the US election, Trump's made another nomination.
Which wonderful and delightful individual has he picked this time, I hear you say?
Rex Tillerson, the CEO of Exxon Mobil, who's a good mate of Putin, who awarded him the Order of Friendship.
You really couldn't make this **** up. It's like someone's taking the piss for a whole year.
Am I in a ****ing coma or something?
Which wonderful and delightful individual has he picked this time, I hear you say?
Rex Tillerson, the CEO of Exxon Mobil, who's a good mate of Putin, who awarded him the Order of Friendship.
You really couldn't make this **** up. It's like someone's taking the piss for a whole year.
Am I in a ****ing coma or something?