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Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by white_gunner, Apr 11, 2017.

  1. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    Obviously not anybody but someone who can be a suitable stop gap for a year. I think there a few candidates that can do that. But i fear some fans, including yourself, don't realise the negative impact Wenger is having and would have staying on for even a single year. I get that people revere him, but there is a time when you look past that and think what's best for the club.
     
    #21
  2. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    I'm a pragmatist. Wenger will always be a legend for Arsenal, but he should go now. What I'm saying is that it's okay if and it's a big if, we can get somebody in to manage the club in the scenario that you want. But the reality is that if you just get rid of Wenger now for the sake of ensuring he is gone, then it's likely that we'll end up rudderless for a year and that could be catastrophic. If nobody is lined up to take over Wenger, which it looks that way, then he should stay until somebody is. Yes there will be fan resentment, but in the bigger picture our stability as a club is more important.
     
    #22
  3. BrunelGooner

    BrunelGooner Well-Known Member

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    I can totally understand why you have this point of view, but my biggest worry is that fans are already massively on his case and are demanding for him to exit. If he stays on and things don't improve quickly (which I don't think they would anyway), the toxicity will become even worse than it is now, there will be more empty seats, more fighting, more protests, increased negative chanting and, ultimately, all of this will affect what happens on the pitch into the next season. He's starting to become, if not he already is, a despised figure at the club. I just don't see how he can get out of this spiral of despondency. The media scrutiny is doing him no favours either.

    I really do think it could perhaps be better in the short-term for someone else to take over the reigns as a temp. Someone who won't be as under the spotlight, a new voice with new ideas etc. We've seen an upturn in fortunes for clubs that get different managers in for a temporary period. It's happened in recent times at Chelsea, Spurs, Leicester, Sunderland etc. It may not be sustainable in the long-term, but results do seem to get better this way, despite the questionable ethical and moral elements to it all.
     
    #23
  4. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    No you're not being a pragmatist otherwise you wouldn't suggest Wenger should stay on for year after all the problems that are occurring with Arsenal because of him. What on earth do you expect will happen when he shows his mug first thing next season, boo's will ring out the stadium, there is that much poison amongst the fanbase. We will continue to see the toxic atmosphere in the grounds and more fights will break out. I wonder why you've conveniently ignored this? Wenger's time is done at this level, he simply cannot compete with all the top managers now. Buying a few players in the transfer window will only throw good money at a bad problem.

    Wenger is a problem, bigger than people realise. Wenger has become institutionalised under Arsenal life, which is utterly wrong. The management should be calling the shots, not the manager.
     
    #24
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  5. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    He isn't good enough to hang with the top dogs anymore. You think he can touch any of the Chelsea and Spurs now? Liverpool, City and United are getting better and are all better now. Wenger ran out of ideas years ago but had the luck of having crappier teams around him. His one dimensional tactics, playing style and lack of man management will really be shown up even more next season. With all this talk of financially keeping up with the rest, the man can't even keep hold of his players anymore.
     
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  6. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    Sorry fella but I disagree. If we have somebody lined up to replace him, great. If we can get somebody like Hiddink in for a year, great. But what we should not do is just dispense with him with no plan of who will manage the club or shove any old Joe in there because it's simply somebody different from Wenger. That would be a case of jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

    You might not like to hear it, but fans booing, negative media and protests is something the club can deal with if it ultimately means ensuring the stability of the club is maintained. I'm not ignoring it at all, I want change too. But I do not want to simply throw it all up in the air in the hope that it will land in a more organised way than it is now, because that is just gambling on a whim and the club won't do it.
     
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  7. BrunelGooner

    BrunelGooner Well-Known Member

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    The problem is we're not just getting thrashed by the top dogs anymore. We're getting well-beaten by teams in the bottom half of the table. It's absolutely incredible how we looked dead set for top 4 to now looking like getting beaten every week. The players have no appetite to battle anymore. Not even for their professional pride. And we've seen it before. As a manager, once the players stop playing for you, your time is over. There's no way he is going to turn this situation around. If he stays for another year or two years, he is just delaying the inevitable.
     
    #27
  8. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    Has Wenger lost the dressing room or are they feeling the pressure of getting top 4? Maybe they don't believe in themselves anymore? Whatever the reason it's very worrying and i can't see Wenger rectifying any of these issues anymore, he simply isn't a good enough man manager to reverse things.
     
    #28
  9. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    Dude we are the Arsenal not some poxy tin pot outfit. You're telling me we are that bloody useless that they can't arrange for a suitable manager to fill in for a year without causing the club to implode? Are you saying that they are that incompetent? In that case, what do you think will happen when Wenger leaves, will the Arsenal totally collapse?

    It's frankly pathetic that we have no faith that the management can make competent decisions for the future of our club that doesn't revolve around Monsieur Wenger. Don't you see the problem with that?
     
    #29
  10. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    To be fair, he's always got us out of a tight spot before. When we've had a **** run, he has usually managed to turn things around. But this time it feels different, the defeat to Palace was the worst Arsenal performance I've ever seen (bar the 8-2 at Utd).
     
    #30

  11. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    On the contrary, I see the problem that Wenger has now become. What I'm saying is that clearly the club have not looked at his successor and yes, I think at this moment in time they have not arranged for a suitable manager to fill in for a year and yes, in this area the board have been, if not incompetent, then at least negligent.

    When Wenger finally leaves, I hope it is because the board have secured a suitable successor. But at this moment in time, that is not the case. If they can line up somebody like Hiddink for a year, then great I'd be all for it. But If they just shove him out of the door and shove somebody in there simply because it's somebody different to Wenger, then I think that's a recipe for disaster.
     
    #31
  12. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    I thought so too but this season is something else, trust me, something has changed. I don't see any turnarounds under Wenger, not with this gutless squad and it would take an amazing summer transfer spree to make a change, but Wenger doesn't do those. We are talking in access of £200m to crack top 4, which isn't happening.
     
    #32
  13. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    I agree, something has changed this season and I don't see any way back for Wenger now. I just hope that we manage to keep hold of Sanchez and Ozil in the summer, even if that looks like it might take a miracle now.
     
    #33
  14. Bodinki

    Bodinki You're welcome
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    Pixie, you really think the team could withstand another season of this?
    Infighting, Banners, planes, fans turning on the players and telling them they are not fit to wear the shirt......
    You are insane if you think Wenger can do anything about this.....you are probably not getting top 4 this season, and if he stays you will not get it next season either.
    Literally anyone at this point would be better than Wenger, even if you poached someone like Jaap Stam from Reading or Gary Monk from Leeds.
    What's happening right now is completely untenable......I dread to think what will happen to Arsenal next season if they have to put up with a whole other season of this....bearing in mind you will likely be without Sanchez and Ozil too.
    Without Sanchez this season you would have been midtable!
     
    #34
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  15. winifred122

    winifred122 Well-Known Member

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    I am with Piskie to a degree in that just making change for change sake is potentially very dangerous. I am saddened by the way that Wenger's stock has fallen to such a low level but have to agree that he has been the architect of his own downfall. Having looked closely at what has changed so much since just before the end of the year, when we were on a decent unbeaten run, it's clear that the team needed handling differently from the norm and that just didn't happen. Without doubt this is the worst we have been under Wenger and the standards he set for himself in his first ten years. (It's not the worst Arsenal period I have ever known, but that is irrelevant and just shows my age up). Something HAS changed. The players all look gutless, clueless and rudderless. At the end of the day that has to rest at Wenger's feet and his media protection of his players is making him now look a bit foolish. The media love the fact that he's 'dithering' over his own contract and is fuelling their lust for cheap and easy stories. (I'm not blaming the media - I love it when I read crap stories about Pedro the Fisherman and others). It has always been the Arsenal way to not fuel speculation, but modern times and media developments make that an unsafe approach. Has he lost the dressing room? Are the rumours of discontent amongst players all true? Fact is I, like most of you, will never be able to answer that until the books are written. However, given the amount he has been paid, he should handle his PR a bit better.
    Sadly, it is his own fault that he and his team are given such grief at the games. I have admired him for years knowing that one day he, naturally, would have to step down. It is now that time. I hope he can do it with another FA Cup under his belt.
    As for who comes in and when - well that is a decision for a competent board. I wish we had one.
     
    #35
  16. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    You're absolutely right and I think some people are missing the point. It's not a matter of making a change for the sake of making a change, the situation with Wenger has become toxic with the fans. So no matter what mistake he makes, and believe me he will as proven by the last 10 years plus, it will get multiplied.

    Next season will get messy, that is obvious when Wenger continues next season.
     
    #36
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  17. Bodinki

    Bodinki You're welcome
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    If it was just a case of the results not being up to snuff, then i'd agree with Piskie that another season to find a replacement would be the way to go.
    But with the fans fighting each other, the toxic atmosphere in the stadium and the attitude towards the players from the fans (which the players must 100% sense by the way), he just cannot stay.....if you lose Sanchez, AND Wenger stays, next season for Arsenal will resemble last season for Chelsea, mark my words.
     
    #37
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  18. cini65

    cini65 Well-Known Member

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    Where do we go from here? It's obvious... Big Tone showing he's still got it and knows exactly what he's doing. GET HIM IN!

     
    #38
  19. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    This is how far we've fallen with Wenger.

     
    #39
  20. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    He used to strike fear in them, now he's a PL joke. Unfortunately only him and his blind supporters don't see it.
     
    #40

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