Off Topic Lesbos Island and Political Thread

Discussion in 'Swansea City' started by 55282, Sep 9, 2015.

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Which way will you vote in the EU referendum?

Poll closed Jun 26, 2016.
  1. In

    24.2%
  2. Out

    75.8%
  1. BobbyD

    BobbyD Well-Known Member

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    My apologies, you have mentioned you are not right wing and i'd forgotten. Would islamaphobe be more appropriate? Not necessarily against your views i just think some of the articles posted are a bit disingenuous (not that you have necessarily intended for it to be).

    No doubt Miss Maples sounds like she could potentially be a nightmare neighbour (unfortunately we will never know), i don't think have a pro tory pro brexit poster should culminate in that notice.

    Also i hate legal aid with a passion. For open and shut cases and trivial appeals, i think we should just do away with it irrespective of having a human lawyer being a right. Biggest waste of money. Then again the poor should be allowed legal representation so i guess its hard to implement with a particular set of rules... and you'd need people to administer them... oh well
     
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  2. Matthew Bound Still Lurks

    Matthew Bound Still Lurks Well-Known Member

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    Whats the worse of the two ideals , left wing or right wing ? and if you're one of them what gives you the moral high ground over the other ?
     
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  3. BobbyD

    BobbyD Well-Known Member

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    I think i prefer more left wing ideals, but i don't care for how this left wingism is being implemented, the name calling and intolerance of the ideas from the right and the blatant biasedness in our supposedly objective media sources. At least with the DM which i don't read or care about know what they stand for and do not seek to present itself as a impartial source.

    i'm neither. I'm probably more conservative but i really just apply things on a case by case which you can't really apply to a country as you need to set clear and hard rules.

    for example:

    I believe in the welfare state and that some people were born disadvantaged and need a help up. I don't normally vote but would have gone tory in 2010as i believed people on benefits were taking the piss. The latest changes to reduce benefits further even though we are seem high levels of unemployment was too much though as i believe people are already in tough times. Whilst i don't really approve of people who are on benefits on "luxuries" like alcohol, entertainment and cigarretes and think this is money mis spent, i do apprenciate that special occasions is okay.

    For me benefits is a safety net rather than a lifestyle choice but theres no easy system in place to say who is worthy of it and who is playing the system, especially for the physical and mentally handicapped who should get more money.

    In an ideal world everyone would have everything and i guess food, luxuries etc would come from trees or robots. However i'm very much a pragmatist and know that will never exist, so i think everyone should work and the people who work harder should get rewarded more. If benefits were too high, the inherently lazy (myself included) who do not like working (maybe i should find an appropriate job) would choose not to work and just live life although i appreciate some people do enjoy working and will continue to do so. Society wouldn't be able to function like that though.

    I also agree on the death penalty for certain crimes like rape and paedophilia. I do not think there we should have the death penalty though as i understand there can be miscarriages of justice and theres no turning back on those. Likewise people define rape as rape but theres rape where a man forces himself upon a girl and theres rape where 2 people are drunk and the girl cannot remember. Obviously in the latter if someone is passed out that is wrong, but if shes functioning and you cannot tell because shes still speaking etc how can that be classed if you see what i'm saying.

    I'm also pretty anti corporations at the moment. They are there to purely make money. They do make things more efficient but when they get to big they monopolise things, are not efficient and instead efficiency is improved by either pushing down prices from the means of production or by cutting staff and making existing staff work harder and generally do not care for the local society.

    anyway, enough of my ranting just a few of my thoughts
     
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  4. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    I don't think you're ranting at all, Bobby. In fact, your views are remarkably similar to mine. I agree on almost everything there. Guess that makes you 'Right Wing". :emoticon-0105-wink: Oh, apart from the death penalty thing where you seem a little muddled. Not sure what you are saying there, but maybe it's me. Personally I'd only have it for terrorist offences, conducting, planning or assisting - but that's just my opinion. Paedophiles can't be cured - just keep them away from society for life. Terrorists on the other hand indoctrinate other youngsters in prison. End them - it's the only way.

    As for that awful word 'Islamophobia', well that's a construct of the Left who want to ring-fence that particularly intolerant credo from any criticism at all. However, any time you want to debate its inherent antipathy towards women, gays and other minorities - you let me know. Isn't it curious that those causes are close to the heart of those on the Left yet Islam is off limits? Hypocrisy of the highest order.

    But more than anything I'd welcome your explanation on your use of the word 'disingenuous' when describing my views. You may disagree - that's part of healthy debate - but being disingenuous is not something I've ever been accused of, either here or in the real world.

    I'm genuinely interested where you're coming from. <ok>
     
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  5. BobbyD

    BobbyD Well-Known Member

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    Oh i'm for the death penalty in certain circumstances if we were 100% sure on any decision and for certain crimes (not all), examples given but obviously there are probably more. However thats an ideal world, we will probably never know 100% and also there could be an abuse of power so its not something i would like for that purpose

    With respect to islamophobia and maybe i'm using the word incorrectly, i accept that you are not necessarily against islam itself and don't think all muslims are bad, but i guess its more that you dont think islam is every compatible with western life because of some of the teachings from quran that islamic extremists use and its something you feel strongly against. if i've caused offence using this, then i apologise. I don't have an argument against except that you could probably say the same for the bible but i can understand why you would think this. I do not have a solution to this problem and i think people will be indoctrinated irrespective of islam or not. Where i disagree with the leftist is more that we are not allowed to criticise anything islam and also the fact that islam in england is starting to encrouch on our lives.

    Its not necessarily your views that i think are disingenous or that you are deliberately doing it, but some of the links and facts that are peddled i think are although its not something i have gone to try and verify from a number of sources, especially since leftist media won't report it and the BBC won't either unless it fits their narrative. The only time you might get reporting on an event is if its big enough but that's very rare.

    One last thing, just as we don't like things like the guardian and BBC peddling out liberalist articles upon liberalist article, at times it would be nice to hear some genuine liberalist thoughts here (not from dai though who is a copy and paste merchant and just spews "facts" that aren't really facts and all opinions).
     
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  6. Newportswan

    Newportswan Well-Known Member

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    And the lowest gun crime in the world is in Japan. In fact not just low but almost Zero. Makes you think when Chicago figures show 9 shot and killed and 54 shot and wounded since 1st Jan 2017.
     
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  7. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    I know what you mean on sources, Bobby. In fact I find hardly any are truy independent. Breitbart is obviously right of centre whilst the Guardian is the Corbyn Daily News.

    I tend to look at articles for what they are. If something is reported elsewhere and if the sources are quoted and named then I tend to give it some credence. But even then its veracity is questionable.

    Take Aleppo. Reuters, AP, Sky, BBC all reporting events there when they actually had nobody on the ground. The 'news' was second or even third hand. I challenged Dominic Waghorn on Twitter about this (he's with Sky) and he basically said that Sky only report what other outlets report and if AP says it's true then it is. I think that's highly dangerous and deliberately misleading.

    On the other hand they tout propaganda as news. The Syrian girl Bana for example. I have photos of her in which she appears with known, named terrorists. ISIS sympathisers and jihadis. One of these lovely chaps we know went on to be involved in the kidnapping & beheading of an 11 year old boy. It's clear from the pics and is at least some evidence that something's up but none of the media report on that because ot spoils the 'good news story' whilst reinforcing the mantra of regime change.

    As for the dangers of Islam it's come from studying it and reading about it at length. Whilst I acknowledge most Muslims are peaceful I'm highly critical of their belief system - yes, even theirs - based on what I've learned. It's not good. I've been involved in spats on Twitter with 'peaceful' Muslims and some of their views will shock you regarding gays and women.

    That mindset is completely incompatible with Western values of individual freedom and we should say so. Over time we can only hope that the more enlightened Muslims who pay lip service to Islam (there are millions of them) become the norm.
     
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  8. Newportswan

    Newportswan Well-Known Member

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    At the start of the 20th century there was a movement in the UK to embrace islam. Many upper class people bought into it and said it was refreshing, but as they started to get more deeply involved they realised it was not what it appears on the surface. and all left the religion. Back then it did not have the hold in Europe it has now. And also women did not have the vote and homosexuality was against the law so the religion was less out of step, but now we are poles apart and this will come to a head sometime soon.
     
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  9. swantastic

    swantastic Well-Known Member

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    Heres a copy n paste for you.
     
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  10. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    #5150
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  11. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    I had the offer to go to Turkey this year as my mate has an apartment in Marmaris. I said thanks but no thanks because I really don't think it's safe anymore. Look at what secular Turkey has become:

     
    #5151
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  12. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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  13. trundles left foot

    trundles left foot Well-Known Member

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    Does that idiot not realise that his constituency voted overwhelmingly to leave the EU, call me old fashioned but I thought he was the to represent them. Dick Head.
     
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  14. swantastic

    swantastic Well-Known Member

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    The battle for Britain / Brexit is on big time now and to deny the result of the majority that voted out would be dangerous new ground for those that would pervert our democratic right to leave , shaking it to its very foundation. They know it ,we know it and we dont forget or forgive when our way of life, security and freedom is challenged !

    I saw Obahmas farewell speech early hours too and all i felt was bored with the constant bullshit coming from that clown !
    But Trumps speech was totally different no bullshit just big balls backed up with real details and humour especially pretty much telling the leaky information security mob and fake media there and everywhere to **** right off ! hilarious.

    Ftse has been breaking records this week highest ever i think when it went over 7300 pts and other economics are doing much much better than we were told they would do by so called experts after the Brexit victory. Trumps admin saying we will have favourable first in line deals with USA helped lift things too ! So much for obahma and camorons BS last in line aye !
     
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  15. Newportswan

    Newportswan Well-Known Member

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    All the moaners like Gina Miller and Sir Andrew Cook are only interested in how it affects their little world. The single market is **** we were once the greatest trading nation on earth.If we can break free of the EU shackles the world is our oyster. I have been in business and traded all over the world we do not need the single market.
     
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  16. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    The Trump story fascinates me because it was broken by the ultra-unreliable Buzzfeed and the editor openly stated at the time that they questioned its veracity. The lamestream media then swung into action and gave it coverage it never deserved without mentioning the source or that it was released with a lot of reservations about its truth.

    Yet it's those same media outlets that constantly moan about "fake news". <doh>
     
    #5156
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  17. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    Political correctness. This kid gets it.

     
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  18. swantastic

    swantastic Well-Known Member

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    Good vid kiff, I especially like the Ricky line at the end <cheers>
     
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  19. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    Just for those who don't know.....



    please log in to view this image
     
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  20. swantastic

    swantastic Well-Known Member

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    Thank fk for the channel at least it slows down some of the illegals !

    Is Dai's ban up yet ? The voice of unreason is due back now shirly ?
     
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