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End of season thoughts

Discussion in 'Arsenal' started by ToledoTrumpton, May 21, 2017.

  1. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    The prospect of the Europa league doesn't excite me very much, it's a long drawn out competition that only really gets exciting at around the QF stage. I'd rather see us rest our first team (or most of them) and concentrate on trying to get back into the top 4 next season. We do have enough depth in the squad to put out a team of mostly reserves, peppered with 2-3 first team players and I'd much rather see us take this approach.
     
    #21
  2. remembercolinlee

    remembercolinlee Well-Known Member

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    It's only 2 games more drawn out than the CL. I do not get the dismissing of a trophy yet virtually all clubs dismiss it...including us .
     
    #22
  3. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    Is it really ? I thought it was much longer than that. Well in that case I hope we go out and win it <diva>
     
    #23
  4. remembercolinlee

    remembercolinlee Well-Known Member

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    It's 6 group games and it has a round of 32 knockout which is the extra 2 matches.
    The real difference is the prize money. I recall reading the winner makes very little from the whole competition.
     
    #24
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  5. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    As PNP has mentioned, I'd rather see us put out a second string side for Europa games. I want us to concentrate on getting back into the top 4 next season, as Maureen is going to spend a **** load of cash and so is Pep and Conte. I think the other spot will be between Arsenal, Spurs and Liverpool next season. I don't see Spurs being able to make Wembley a fortress like they did with WHL, so I think you'll drop points.
     
    #25
  6. BobbyD

    BobbyD President

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    Sums up wengers attitude in one here.

    You'd rather get Top 4 than win a trophy (with the additional bonus of a CL spot).

    At least say you'd try to win the league!
     
    #26
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  7. PINKIE

    PINKIE Wurzel Gummidge

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    We'll try of course, but being realistic we're not going to.
     
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  8. excel

    excel Active Member

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    Totally agree.Good post.
     
    #28
  9. enigma

    enigma Well-Known Member

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    We should be looking to win the EL, look at the teams Man U have faced to get to the final, in the early group stages we should be able to play squad players such as elneny ect and still get through relatively comfortably. even in the knock-out rounds i would have had us comfortably beating those teams man u beat. A lot depends on the quality of the teams that drop out from the CL, with the team spurs have had in the last 5-6 years they should have at least got to one final.
     
    #29
  10. Solid_Air 2

    Solid_Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    the money is pretty good these days. We got (Pool) approx 34m (cant remember euros or GBP) but a sizeable chunk of that was earned by end of round of 32.
     
    #30
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  11. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    2016/17 Europa League revenue distribution
    http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/news/newsid=2398584.html

    A total of more than €399.8m will be shared among the clubs in the 2016/17 UEFA Europa League and we explain how it is distributed from qualifying to the final.

    HOW THE MONEY IS SHARED OUT

    Group stage onwards

    Forecast amounts
    The net amount available to the participating clubs will be split on a 60:40 basis between fixed amounts and variable amounts (market pool). Therefore, €239.8m will be distributed as fixed amounts and €160m as variable amounts (market pool).

    Fixed amounts (€239.8m)

    Allocation to all group stage participants: €2.6m.
    Group stage performance bonus per win: €360,000
    Group stage performance bonus per draw: €120,000
    Non-distributed amounts (€120,000 per draw) will be pooled and redistributed among the clubs playing in the group stage in amounts proportionate to their number of wins.
    Group winners bonus: €600,000
    Group runners-up bonus: €300,000
    Round of 32 appearance: €500,000
    Round of 16 appearance: €750,000
    Quarter-final appearance: €1m
    Semi-final appearance: €1.6m
    The UEFA Europa League winners can expect to receive €6.5m and the runners-up €3.5m, inclusive of their share of ticket revenue from the final (no additional amount will be paid to the finalists in relation to ticketing as was customary in the past).
    A club could receive, at best, €15.71m, not including their market pool share.

    Market pool (€160m)

    The estimated available amount of €160m will be distributed according to the proportional value of each television market represented by the clubs taking part in the group stage onwards and be split among the clubs participating from a given association.

    a) Half of the global market pool (€80m) will be split into as many shares as there are national associations represented by at least one club in the group stage. Each share, proportional to the value of the relevant media rights market, will be split among the clubs based on their performance in the previous season’s domestic competitions. The following split will apply among the clubs from any given association.

    If the domestic cup winner does not qualify for the UEFA Europa League group stage, the market pool distribution will be split equally among all the participating clubs from the relevant national association.
    Domestic cup winners eliminated in the UEFA Champions League qualifying rounds and moving to the UEFA Europa League will be considered as cup winners as far as the distribution plan is concerned.
    b) The other half of the market pool (€80m) will be split into as many shares as there are rounds in the competition, as follows:

    Group stage (40%) €32m
    Round of 32 (20%) €16m
    Round of 16 (16%) €12.8m
    Quarter-finals (12%) €9.6m
    Semi-finals (8%) €6.4m
    Final (4%) €3.2m

    Each of the above shares will be split into as many portions as there are national associations represented by at least one club in the round concerned, proportional to the value of the relevant media rights markets.
    Each national association share will be split equally among all the clubs participating in that round from a given national association.
    The various amounts distributed from the market pool on a club-by-club basis can only be confirmed once all the contracts have been finalised and not before the end of the competition, since the exact amount for each club depends on five factors:

    The actual final amount in the market pool.
    The composition of the field of clubs participating in the 2016/17 UEFA Europa League.
    The number of clubs from any given association competing in the 2016/17 UEFA Europa League.
    The results of each competing club in the previous season’s domestic competitions.
    The performance of each club in the 2016/17 UEFA Europa League.
    Additional amounts
    Any additional amounts available for distribution to clubs as a result of higher gross commercial revenue (surplus) will be split on a 60:40 basis between fixed amounts and the market pool, as decided by the UEFA Executive Committee on the recommendation of the Club Competitions Committee.

    SOLIDARITY PAYMENTS

    Teams in qualifying
    In the new distribution system, the pot for payments to clubs participating in the UEFA Champions League and UEFA Europa League qualifying rounds will be equal to 3.5% of the overall gross revenue. Based on the forecast of €2.35bn in overall revenue, €82.2m will be distributed to the clubs in both competitions with the teams defeated in UEFA Europa League qualifying receiving the following amonts:

    First qualifying round – €215,000
    Second qualifying round – €225,000
    Third qualifying round – €235,000
    Play-offs – €245,000 (only eliminated clubs)
     
    #31
  12. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    It is well worth competing in the Europa as long as you have the squad to do it with. Obviously the Premiership should be the priority but it's all about getting the best out of your entire squad.
     
    #32
  13. Solid_Air 2

    Solid_Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    summary :bandit:
     
    #33
  14. lazarus20000

    lazarus20000 Well-Known Member

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    Payments come from three different areas, playing in the tournament through the stages, the market pool which is TV revenues etc and solidarity payments for clubs coming from the CL.

    For example, the 2014/15 winners Sevilla received some €19.1m for their successful campaign. This amount comprised over €9.8m from the market pool, and €9.3 in participation and performance bonuses. Semi-finalists Napoli received the second largest overall amount, over €12.2m, and were followed by Fiorentina and Wolfsburg, who were both paid some €10.5m.

    Of course the available amounts have gone up since, but this gives you an idea of how much clubs can make. Also if you take into account ticket sales, merchandising, extra advertising and overall interest in the club, then you set to make a tidy sum.
     
    #34
  15. ToledoTrumpton

    ToledoTrumpton Well-Known Member

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    The only thing I really strongly thake exception to is that Sanchez works harder than Ozil. It may look like he is running more but it turns out that the guy runs about 1K less than Ozil every game.

    He spends as much time lying on he ground complaining as he does sprinting, and he is ALWAYS late coming back to help Monreal. He chases down useless balls around the goalkeeper and then when the camera is off him, walks back to the half-way line.

    In 2016 Sanchez was flat last out of ALL Arsenal players in distance covered in the Champions League. He was the most lazy player at Arsenal.

    I like Sanchez, but this myth he is a hard worker is just that. It has been debunked many times.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...al-players-how-do-they-rank-by-work-rate.html
    https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...-arsenal-defence-alexis-sanchez-arsene-wenger
    http://www.skysports.com/football/n...ning-and-sprint-stats-hint-at-arsenal-problem
    http://sport.bt.com/football/arsena...out-alexis-sanchezs-work-rate-S11364161615343
    http://www.allarsenal.com/2015/05/u...ed-lazy-mesut-ozil-5th-but-no-alexis-sanchez/

    So here is the problem with so many Arsenal fans. They know so little about the game, that they think that the laziest player on the team is the hardest worker. When they are that mistaken about a fact that is easy to check and see in the game, how can you discuss more complex issues with them?

    Quite frankly, I'd be perfectly justified in saying, we don't need lazy players like Sanchez at Arsenal
     
    #35
  16. BobbyD

    BobbyD President

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    just because Ozil jogs around more and thus covers more distance doesn't mean he isn't lazy. It's all about intensity in your running. When you see players like Ozil not defending properly because he's jogging around you only need to see how people breeze past him compared to Ozil.

    Ozil might be more important to how Arsene wants you to play (pass pass pass) but it is blindingly obvious that in games where you guys are being bullied, Sanchez tries to make things happen whilst Ozil just gets bullied off the ball.

    Give me all the run stats you want, but Cesc frequently offers lots of running but defensively the guy is a massive liability cause he cannot run around with any intensity.
     
    #36
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  17. ToledoTrumpton

    ToledoTrumpton Well-Known Member

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    So you missed the article with the stats where Ozil wins the ball back in the final third more than Sanchez? You are just talking bollocks. The guy is setting records with work-rate, tackles, assists, and gets up and down the field faster than your fat slow Sanchez who NEVER gets in behind and checks back, every time he is put through, but still cant get back to help out defensively with any consistency.

    If you compare Ozil to Fabregas, which is rubbish, then Sanchez is like Giroud. Too slow, so he doesn't cover enough ground, even though he looks like he is working his socks off.

    To be honest, Sanchez is more like Fabregas than Ozil is.
     
    #37
    Last edited: May 22, 2017
  18. BobbyD

    BobbyD President

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    are you talking about this one? https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...-arsenal-defence-alexis-sanchez-arsene-wenger

    Firstly, he has the same number of interceptions as sanchez and literally half of the tackles. Think that tells it own story considering as you put it, sanchez doesn't even run.

    Then you need to consider that considering Sanchez doesn't run a lot, and Nacho and Gibbs also don't run in said article

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/fo...al-players-how-do-they-rank-by-work-rate.html

    Then your left hand size must be damn right lazy and abysmal and produce next to nothing. Funny how Bellerin runs one of most (maybe to cover for Ozil who is busy jogging everywhere).

    Lastly, Fabregas runs more than Ozil averaging 11.17 kg so is definitely more in line with Ozil. The reason they clock up more is because they run into space to receive the ball and pass it on and always offer a pass. Both are poor defensively.

    http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/10161166/hardest-working-players
     
    #38
  19. ToledoTrumpton

    ToledoTrumpton Well-Known Member

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    Well, you see, I don't know what you are seeing. I see Bellerin and Ozil up and down that right flank, working their socks off in both directions. I see Sanchez not getting back, so Monreal and Gibbs have to stay put more to cover for the fat lazy bastard.

    his little stubby legs are going fast, but that doesn't mean he covers the ground quickly, or that he covers very much of it. As I say he never manages to get behind the defense and always checks back. Ozil does manage to get in behind. The fact that Ozil is faster and he covers more ground leaves you nowhere to go with this.

    Just say you were talking bollocks and we can be done with it.
     
    #39
  20. BobbyD

    BobbyD President

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    I will agree Sanchez doesn't run in behind as much.

    How do you explain the same number of interceptions and more tackles if he's running far less and walking around? Must mean either Ozil is running inefficiently or he's a **** defender.

    Him covering more ground doesn't mean he's not lazy. Anyway looks like this year he's a bit more fed up, covering even less ground than usual compared to the previous seasons.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...ue-midfielders-season-far/mesut-ozil-arsenal/

    Anyway unfortunately, this is a subjective debate, i will use my eyes, you can use your distance covered and we will agree to disagree.
     
    #40

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